Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Yes, but that doesn't mean you can anchor there.

maybe, but unlikely as the anchorages in ActiveCaptain are only there because someone did it and wrote a review

I've written numerous anchorage reviews for places that didn't indicate a place to anchor at before that. That is the whole point of people writing the reviews.

[soverel]

http://www.boatus.com/gov/floridaanchoring.asp



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[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by soverel

The document is still applicable ie florida has not changed laws as of yet. This was put out after pilot programs started to clarify.

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I can see trying to argue with an LEO that this three yr old document is still valid is all.

[letsgetsailing3]

Originally Posted by CarlF

The last lines of the PDF on the law says:

It is important to note that the 2009 legislation that created these programs also placed an end to the pilot program on July 1st, 2014. All local ordinances enacted under this section “shall expire concurrently with the expiration of the pilot program and shall be inoperative and unenforceable thereafter” unless they are reenacted by the Legislature.

So what is the situation on July 16, 2014?

I believe it was extended, but don't know how long and don't have time to look it up at the moment.

[ShaktiGurl]

It was extended until July 1, 2017

http://www.flsenate.gov/Committees/B.../2014/html/880

http://www.waterwayguide.com/waterwa...tes/news//3680

The additional restrictions did not pass.



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[IdoraKeeper]

I wonder what restrictions a megayacht or a cruise ship would encounter? Don't think you can compare your problems in Fla with most spots on the west coast. Anchorages out west are much more restricted by mother nature. Don't even think about Hawaii, that's really restricted. You guys have it good in most ways. Its knee jerk politics that make it hard to maintain a rational situation.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by IdoraKeeper

I wonder what restrictions a megayacht or a cruise ship would encounter? Don't think you can compare your problems in Fla with most spots on the west coast. Anchorages out west are much more restricted by mother nature. Don't even think about Hawaii, that's really restricted. You guys have it good in most ways. Its knee jerk politics that make it hard to maintain a rational situation.

None of the FL pilot program anchorages have enough water to support a megayacht or cruise ship.

Any references to west coast in this thread are about the west coast of Florida...not the left coast of the US! But I do understand you have a different set of issues to deal with.....

[Waterway Guide]

There's a public meeting planned for next week (I unfortunately cannot attend, but will participate) where FWC is going over the options for when the extension ends in 2017. The problem is that anything can happen then. During the passing of the extension legislation earlier this year, attempts were made by local legislators to circumvent the Pilot Program altogether in their areas, which would have allowed them to make up their own laws again (one wanted "no anchoring within 100 yards of a residential property"...look at your favorite anchorage and figure the math out on that one!).

[RKsailsolo]

Thank you waterway guide for standing the watch on this topic.

[sparrowhawk1]

Originally Posted by RKsailsolo

Thank you waterway guide for standing the watch on this topic.

+1 SH1

[Waterway Guide]

ALERT: The Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission announced yesterday that they have scheduled the two new "public workshops" on anchoring regulations. Again, the meetings are scheduled only half a month away and at a time of year when nearly no cruising boaters are in Florida (most cruisers are enjoying a wonderful summer in Northeast, Great Lakes, or the Chesapeake, and many stay north of Florida until the end of hurricane season for insurance purposes).

The purpose of these "workshops" is to draft some proposed state legislation "granting limited authority to counties and municipalities to regulate anchoring on state waters."

Although the subjects of derelict/abandoned boats, anchored live-aboard vessels, and sanitation rules are parts of the proposed framework, this effort was spearheaded by municipalities responding to their waterfront homeowners who want laws to prevent any boaters from anchoring for even one night on state navigable waters adjacent to their properties. These are not the rare cases where the homeowners own the rights to the bottomland – these are navigable waters that belong to all the people of Florida.
More info: ALERT: Florida anchoring regulations meetings announced | General | Waterwayguide.com News Updates

[RKsailsolo]

For those of us who are FL property owners AND sailors, we need a way to make our voices heard without physically being at these planning workshops. I make the distinction as these same local government officials who are over reaching their authority in their response to waterfront property owners also must serve the needs of all constituents including me. Any ideas on making a difference in weighing in remotely against these proposed restrictions are appreciated.

[BandB]

Originally Posted by RKsailsolo

For those of us who are FL property owners AND sailors, we need a way to make our voices heard without physically being at these planning workshops. I make the distinction as these same local government officials who are over reaching their authority in their response to waterfront property owners also must serve the needs of all constituents including me. Any ideas on making a difference in weighing in remotely against these proposed restrictions are appreciated.

As both a Florida waterfront homeowner and as a very active boater and cruiser, I am a member of both groups. I oppose the extreme arguments on both sides. I don't think all anchoring should be eliminated and I don't think you should be able to anchor anything anywhere as long as you want. That's where both sides need to work toward creative compromise that best deals with the real issues of the other side.

Yes, there are some who are going to continue to fight for the extreme solutions but they have been defeated several times and will continue to be so, unless....that unless is that their opposition presents no alternatives other than the all or nothing choices. Both sides need to work toward palatable solutions to the other side.

As a homeowner, I really have few issues. Three basic ones.

1-A means of removing derelict boats from waterway. They not only impact the homeowners negatively but they are in the way of the enjoyment of the waterways by cruisers and eventually a hazard. A derelict boat to me isn't an older boat in need of paint. It's a boat that isn't able to be moved, that isn't being used for boating at all, that isn't being maintained even to the least of standards. 2-Boats should not be left in such a way as to endanger other boat or property. They need to not impact the safety of the waterway and also not put property at risk, rather it's other boats or marinas or docks. I do believe they should be a certain very minimal distance from homes, but I'm not talking a quarter of a mile, just leave 25' clearance or so from my dock so I can still get in and out. 3-The boats should be lawful in terms of proper registrations, being able to pass a USCG inspection, and in disposal of their waste and sewage.

As a cruiser, I have these issues.

1-I want to see economical anchorage and moorage for all cruisers. I love cruising and although I don't anchor often, I do at times. I want there to be adequate safe areas. By economical, I don't mean necessarily free, although I think some free should remain. But give me a nice area with dinghy dock and showers and perhaps a little beach and park nearby for $5 a night or $100 a month and that fits. I want there to be enough to handle the peak demands. I want there to be some for all sizes of boats. 2-I want to be allowed peaceful enjoyment. Periodic checking of safety and ability of the boat to be operated as well as waste and sewage is one thing. But I don't want to be awakened at 2 AM for a check. I want any enforcement aimed toward improving things and dealing with major offenders, not an overzealous effort. I don't want to be checked daily. Give me something I can use to show and remains valid for a period of time. 3-I don't want to be pushed to marinas or pushed to expensive anchorages or moorages. Many choose to cruise on very low budgets and I think should have free and/or low cost options.

Now one I think would benefit all. I'd love to see some simplification and easing of conflicting state laws on registration and taxes. It's almost as bad as Schengen. Perhaps some rule that says the state in which I am personally domiciled. This would simply mean if I live in Florida, my boat must meet Florida requirements. If I have no land home, then it's the state where I spend the greatest amount of time. Maybe some small cruising permit if I exceed 90 days elsewhere, like a $10 permit simply to record I am doing so legally and still not required to do more there. But none of this full registration in multiple states.

Now my personal belief is that if the two sides worked together there could be more and better anchorages and moorages, not fewer. This wouldn't have to limit it to just those areas but would concentrate it in them. There is nothing more beautiful than some of the areas in the Annapolis area. As a landowner I'd love to have such a beautiful group of sailboats in my vision as I wake in the morning. There is nothing more damaging that boats like the Prima Donna or all the derelict boats at Stock Island. Oh and derelict isn't by any means limited to anchorages but a very real problem for marinas and they lack adequate means to deal with it. Unreasonable homeowners, a great minority, hurt the case of all homeowners. Unreasonable or the few bad cruisers, a definite minority, hurt the cause of all cruisers.

Neither side has unlimited rights. The homeowners didn't buy the sky and the sea. They have to respect the cruisers. On the other hand the cruisers need to be good guests and respect the rights of homeowners. As a homeowner, I've never once been bothered by a cruiser anchoring. But I did have a neighbor incur substantial damage to their docks by one who anchored and left their boat and it broke free. Now I recently had a boat that stopped and couldn't get restarted near my dock. They tried to quickly anchor. But we jumped in a dinghy and pulled them to our dock, let them tie up and then got them help on their boat. Turned out it took a day for it to be repaired and we had no problem with them right where they were. They offered to get towed to a marina and we said not necessary. Then I do know those who have anchored a respectable distance only to be harassed by shouting homeowners. Of all places to see that, I saw it in a small town. What I found hilarious was that I was at a marina and could hear every word from there. Yes, they had a 200 boat marina in their immediate view and were somehow greatly disturbed by a 30' sailboat.

While I admire Waterway Guide keeping on top of the issue, I think we need to be careful with some of what we say. Yes, I see the bold type about homeowners wanting all anchoring eliminated, but they are a great minority and I've never felt fear for a moment that would happen. I just lump them with the cruisers who want zero regulations. Neither is going to happen.

I do like the concept of pilot projects and they don't have to all be the same with the same rules. If cruisers have an idea for one, then propose it. This can't be solved by the all or nothing battle but only by jointly working toward a solution. Or in my case my left hand has to work with my right hand. The vast majority of Floridians who live on the water support boating and cruising. That's part of the whole purpose of living on the water. Florida gets the publicity because of it's size as a boating state and because it's among the first to attempt to address the issue. But rest assured other states have issues and will follow. I know one boater who had a gun pointed at them from shore in South Carolina because they were getting in their dinghy.

To each side, I'd encourage rather than concentrating just on what is being said by the other side, work on a solution yourselves. I do believe there's a good solution out there somewhere but don't believe we've heard it yet.

[a64pilot]

I guess I'm a fool, I believe what has worked for 200+ yrs could still work now.
Derelict boats is a problem, but why do you think derelict automobiles isn't?
Put the same rules in place and the derelict boats would cease to exist.
I define a derelict boat as an un-occupied, apparently abandoned boat, if nobody has been aboard in over 30 days, in my mind, that's abandoned.

[Sailmonkey]

To me derelict also means a boat that is occupied but unable to function as it was intended by its builder/designer. ie. a vessel so encumbered by growth, potted plants and other detritus and lack of maintenance as to be unseaworthy.