Skipper cited for violation of rule 9.

[Prairie 36]

Idiot for sure. The term right-a-way can be ambiguous. I hear seasoned CG licensed captions using the term inappropriately. Colregs uses the terms stand-on and give-way where both vessels have the responsibility to stay away from the other. The only reference to right-of-away is mentioned only in Rule 9 and Rule 14 relating to down bound traffic. My point is, right-of-way is thrown around a lot and I think many new boaters think the have the "right-of-way". And, of course, tonnage always rules.

[Cool Hand Luke]

License or not... rules or not... you wouldn't walk across a highway in front of an 18 wheeler speeding down the road. Some things are just common sense... this guy didn't have any.

[rslifkin]

One of the other things I find happens a lot is a lack of understanding of steerage speed. People in very small boats (like 20 foot or less outboard fishing skiffs) seem to love doing 2 - 3 kts in a channel while paying absolutely no attention to traffic anywhere except straight ahead. This leads to situations where they haven't left room for someone with a deeper draft to pass them safely. I've had a few cases of this where I've been left fighting to maneuver in the wind. My boat does about 4 kts at idle, so trying to do 2.5 kts to not run them over means spending lots of time in neutral with very sluggish rudder response, so having to maneuver with the engines and lots of bursts of power while getting blown all over the place. They never respond to horn signals either.

[Gingersnap]

Violation is $14,900. Wow! Maybe we will all pay attention too.

[capt jgw]

Originally Posted by MerMike

It's not the sensible and responsible sailors we're talking about. What's it worth to you to educate the morons enough to keep them from killing you?

Back when I was teaching USCGAux boat safety courses, people asked me why I did it and that is exactly the answer I gave. Self defense!

[CaptTom]

Originally Posted by CaptBobR

...I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had sailboaters tell me they didn’t need to change course because they had the right of way. I love explaining the Law of Gross Tonnage to them in terms of hitting and sinking their sailboat will not likely damage the paint on my boat or barge

As I said, someone is actively teaching them this BS. At every basic boating safety class, I ask for a show of hands: Who's heard that sailboats have right-of-way? Usually almost all the hands go up. I already mentioned my first-hand observation of this being taught to youngsters at sailing school. It's a real problem. Maybe education requirements (not licenses) can help.

Around here you're lucky if they even have their VHF on. Don't want to waste all that battery power, don't ya know.

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Maybe you should try educating them on the actual collision regulations, rather than with nonsense terms and fake rules.

Trying to imagine this over VHF, I can't see it working anywhere near as well as Capt Bob's method. Let's face it, the people we're talking about aren't going to be in a receptive mood for legalities.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Cool Hand Luke

License or not... rules or not... you wouldn't walk across a highway in front of an 18 wheeler speeding down the road. Some things are just common sense... this guy didn't have any.

A great analogy.

[Trawler2016]

Regardless of the "official" rules, your task as skipper, is to avoid a collision at all costs even if it means disregarding said rules until the danger is past.

[Lihuedooley77]

Holy boat of fools, batman ! Check this out !

A huge large commercial carrier vessel painted bloody red, making many knots, and blocking out the sun and half the know world......and this DUMB, SELF ABSORBED RACER cuts across the bow of the huge many thousand tons of steel. with a large
'advance' and not able to stop or answer to the helm for a quick change of course.

And , then comes along the rest of the fleet of racing sailing vessels.

And that is after the Very Large Commercial Carrier has sounded five short blasts on his ships whistle. Which means I DOUBT YOU ARE TAKING SUFFICIENT ACTION TO AVOID COLLISION !!

In our area, our sailing club members would encounter the large commercial vessels, tankers, container ships, etc, that were constrained to the coastwise shipping lanes, many miles off shore between the mainland, and Catalina Island.

They were trained to : Always have some one on watch. Know their position. When observing vessels constrained to the shipping lane. Which was about 90 degrees across their course line. * Check the speed and direction of the VLCC, check for a collision bearing. Understand that behemouth is making many knots to their 5 or 6 kts under sail.

TAKE THE LARGE VESSEL ON HIS STERN. You are not going to win the race, and the VLCC wont even feel the collision and know that you are all dead and gone . There may be some pieces of wreckage snagged on the bow anchor.

The lack of seamanship, knowledge, and common sense is indeed lacking, and totally evident.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We were sailing over to Avalon, Catalina, from Newport, and were well off but approaching the north and south bound coastwise shipping lanes, and heard this exchange on VHF Ch 16.

Remember the crews and captains of large commercial vessels can be from foreign countries....

Chl 16:

Sailboat Delta Sierra : Attention large commercial ship, ( gives rough position ) , this is the sailing vessel, Delta Sierra, and we are entering the shipping lanes and see your ship. We are a sail boat, and have the right of way over you, you are a power boat.

S/V Delta Sierra continues ". We are holding our course and crossing in front of you.

Now, trained and knowledgeble seaman understand that vessels constrained to shipping/ traffic lanes have the right of way.

There is no answer back from the VLCC.

Sailing Vessel Delta Sierra pipes back up on Ch 16 and repeats his previous transmission.

Delta Sierra: "We are holding our course, and since my boat is under sail, I have the right of way. and going to cross bow of the VLCC."

VLCC : Dis is de Captain of the Crude Carrier, World Star. Do not cross our bow, ve are making 22 kts, and it is not safe for you to do so. Go to our stern ! "

Delta Sierra decided to argue : " This is the Sailboat Delta Sierra, and I repeat we are under sail, you are under power, we have the right of way and holding our course. "
This ought to be good .

Our vessel's crew are up topside looking for Dumb Sht, and the tanker, who are maybe a mile off.

The VLCC was quiet for a few seconds and then the capt says .

" Yahhh, Vell den come ahead, come ahead. " Probably after telling the helmsman to add more knots and pulverize this idiot.

The outcome, was the VLCC was making many knots, and there was no collision bearing, and was long past the point of any collision point, before DS even entered the shipping lanes.

Point being, the sailing vessel, had no idea what he was doing, and could have wound up with the sailing vessel destroyed and sunk and all crew killed or badly injured.

Observing knowledgeable skippers, sail, or power, is a mighty good feellng . Which unfortunately is rare .

[StuM]

Originally Posted by CaptBobR

I hold a 1600 GRT Oceans license and work as a tug captain. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had sailboaters tell me they didn’t need to change course because they had the right of way. I love explaining the Law of Gross Tonnage to them in terms of hitting and sinking their sailboat will not likely damage the paint on my boat or barge

Two wrongs don't make a right. You'd be better off explaining COLREGs to them (if you understand them yourself).

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Cadence

Great response!

No, it's a terrible response.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by StuM

No, it's a terrible response.

Was that edited? I thought I said analogy.

[Mudfoot57]

Originally Posted by Valmika

Like this guy?

Note the port authority launch in frame, and read the full MCA investigation it makes very interesting reading.
The tanker signalled he was turning to Starboard but delayed his turn because of a disabled motor boat in his intended turning arc. The yacht was then placed in imminent danger but should have already had his ignition key in and motor engaged but instead did not react The skipper of the racing yacht went to court with the full legal aid of the Royal Naval Reserve and lost.

He should have immediately admitted his mistake, we all make them.
in the Solent and Southampton water VTS are very accommodating but quite correctly most race instructions exclude a result if the yacht gets the 5 or the ships master provides a sail number with any complaint.

The tanker was about to turn round the Brambles bank so was already in the correct channel and protected by a rolling 1000 m zone and 100m either side. What is interesting is that the port authority launch failed to intervene prior to the incident despite beng in the best position to asses what was going on.

Arguably at 3 knots the delay of about 30 seconds in the ships turn is around 50m, in which case had the ship turned when he signalled the yacht would have been about 50m clear of the port side of the ship. The Authorities took all the GPS's and tracks from the yacht, it would be interesting to get this re run on a simulator for training of all concerned.

This was during Cowes week where VTS are in constant communication with the race officials to help avoid delays in starts etc. The incident was during a race.

Thankfully there were no serious casualties. On another occasion Not far from this position we witnessed a 50 ' Bavaria ( on charter) T bone a Corby 36' which was on starboard and the stand on vessel. The Bavaria did not stop! The Corby sank in 45 seconds. All the racing team were wearing life jackets and were rescued by a passing rib in under 2 minutes from clinging from the top of the mast. The female crew member who had a handheld was clear, calm, and directed the Local RNLI RIB from Cowes in for a transfer. Exemplary radio work.

Lesson to be learned wear your life jacket at all times and if you have a handheld keep it attached to someone or secure/ accessible on deck once you leave the dock.

Stay safe , currently in Lockdown but I normally cruise and race in the Solent.

[BigBoater917]

We can all probably tell anecdotal stories all day. I would like to think that very few of us are against anyone having a little more education. Anyone who says they're "too experienced" or "too old" for a class is someone to watch out for on the water.

[refuge]

As a harbor pilot I deal with this all the time. I can assure everyone the CG is locking down on these violations and if a pilot gets a pic of your boat and is upset enough to report you, you’ll get a knock and talk or fine in the mail.

I’m a sailor before I’m a Pilot and I still can’t understand what compels boaters to cut in front of a freighter. Even as a 12 year old sailing my Laser I knew enough to stay out of the way.

Ship pilots are required to take action. While a few hundred feet might seem clear to most boaters, ship officers go into extremis if you’re within a quarter mile off the bow because it takes at least that long to get the ship to respond to a situation. Usually there are other boats in the way and you have to plan on how to run over the least amount of them. It is highly stressful when recreational boats are in the channel. Especially recreational fishing boats.

I’ve had sailboat masts disappear under the bow of a few ships I’ve been piloting. At some point there’s not much a ship can do. While they can alter course a few degrees we also need to worry about the swing of our stern. We are left with the decision of pushing the idiot boat out of the way or cause an oil spill that takes up our national news cycle for 6 weeks, destroys an entire ecosystem, and puts 10,000 people out of work.

As far as state licensing goes, and while it won’t fix stupid, it will shift the liability to the recreational boater. Insurance companies are drooling over this prospect. They are lobbying for recreational boater licenses. And I can hardly argue with them. There needs to be some accountability. While ignorance is not admissible in a court of maritime law it is usually the professional mariner who takes the brunt of an ignorant or drunken mistake of a pleasure boater. With a required license you’ll be held accountable regardless of your actual knowledge and your insurance premium will go sky high with each infraction. As much as I hate big government, recreational boaters’ actions are bringing it down on themselves.

It is very simple, just stay out of the way. If you see a ship in the channel then just get out of the way. Don’t take the mindset that you alone can avoid the ship because you think it is moving slowly enough and your boat is so fast and maneuverable. I’ve seen numerous boats stall at the absolute worst moment, right in front of the ship, and they have children aboard. These individuals particularly need to be crucified. But even if the ship is a mile away, get well outside the channel. Please.