Australia Is Such an Overpriced Sh**hole - AAARGH

[Wotname]

BTW, I agree that Aussie prices are high and I sometimes import personally rather than pay the higher prices but what I exception to is this belief that the retailers are gouging us. Most of the time, it just ain't so.

[Wand]

Originally Posted by RigelKent

Would be a switch to be able to buy our steel and aluminium parts mined, smelted, moulded and machined in Australia. We have the ore and the natural/LPG to do it.

Which political party was it, then, that stands for this?

But strangely we send our ore and gas overseas, only to import the finished products back again at great expense. Or worse, sell it offshore whilst its still in the ground.

That's good in theory but it's pretty much impossible for Aus to turn ore into toasters cheaper than China can do it.

On the bright side, it's the seemingly ever-cheaper Chinese goods that have allowed solid growth in Aus without inflation or a wages blowout.

I mean, throwaway drills at $30 - we could never do that. No need to rock the boat.

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by Wotname

BTW, I agree that Aussie prices are high and I sometimes import personally rather than pay the higher prices but what I exception to is this belief that the retailers are gouging us. Most of the time, it just ain't so.

Thats right, retailers are well aware of the iternet as well, the difference that they can offer is there's the unit you want on that shelf just there and if that one doesn't work you can exchange it.
The first yacht i built i bought most my stuff from a newly opened company at the time called BIAS, It was one of Australia's first Marine warehouses and it hurt the local chandlers no end.
Bias were reacting to a need, buy from a warehouse and cut out the middleman, the local guy suffered simply because of turnover.
Aussie prices are high but i gotta tell you i think Americans believe there prices are high as well, it's all relative to your local economy. This is an island we do have a smaller population the market is confined. Here in Gladstone rents are $550 a week for a three bedroom average house, take home pay for a boilermaker is $1650/49 hr week clear!. Me go back to building boats and try competitvely pay that kind of labour cost???? I dont think so, the times they are a changing id rather be blowing in the wind!

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by At sea

That's good in theory but it's pretty much impossible for Aus to turn ore into toasters cheaper than China can do it.

On the bright side, it's the seemingly ever-cheaper Chinese goods that have allowed solid growth in Aus without inflation or a wages blowout.

I mean, throwaway drills at $30 - we could never do that. No need to rock the boat.

And with replacement warranty!!!!! lmao

[Wand]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

And with replacement warranty!!!!! lmao

Yes, and a 'no questions' warranty at that. If you happen to burn it out at 11 months, bunnings swap it in a jif. It's the magic pudding!

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by At sea

That's good in theory but it's pretty much impossible for Aus to turn ore into toasters cheaper than China can do it.

On the bright side, it's the seemingly ever-cheaper Chinese goods that have allowed solid growth in Aus without inflation or a wages blowout.

I mean, throwaway drills at $30 - we could never do that. No need to rock the boat.

And because of this we have a classic case of dutch disease - australia

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

Here in Gladstone rents are $550 a week for a three bedroom average house, take home pay for a boilermaker is $1650/49 hr week clear!.

I feel sorry for the bus driver, the school teacher, the checkout chick etc

[Wand]

Originally Posted by cat man do

And because of this we have a classic case of dutch disease - australia

Well, i agree it's real but imho it's a syndrome rather than a disease and can be identified in any select group of economies at any point in modern history.

And a syndrome is not a disaster like a disease can be - one door shuts and another opens. Twenty years ago some observers in Aus were calling the removal of the tariffs in the clothing and footwear industry in this country as a terrible job destroyer.

Which is was in the short term, but jobs opened up elsewhere. Aus has virtually zero unemployment these days and, of course, almost unimaginably cheap clothing and footwear from China et al.

Nothing ever stays the same and trying to make it thus is always a bad economic stategy.

[AllezCat]

I think Australia is very overpiriced but soe things are not.
Does it balance out with America - no - definately not.

I am Australian and have spent over 20 years OS and USA.
I returned to Australia in 2000 and gots me a University education. Total bill about 12 bucks.
Equivalent in America -who knows? - but it is not uncommon to have 100k student loan debt to repay (which cannot be expunged by bankruptcy). My daughter pays 30k per year for kindergarten.
I would have stayed in Australia - but I believe there is more opportunity in USA - better conduit to small business (not anymore).
The internet quoat in Australia is so frustrating -extraordinary high prices compared to the rest of the world (including the third world).
I do not believe it is a necessity it is because they can - there is less competition.
Similar to an expensive hotel in America - a cheap to average hotel has free WIFI, free parking, free coffee in room, free breakfast. An expensive hotel has pay for WIFI, pay for parking , pay for everything. etc...
We think the Westmarine is expensive. I have further discounts which vary from product to product. For instance electronics may have 5% discount other things such as a bronze fitting lists at 12.99 but I was charged 3.10 - but probably 2.00 at a plumbing supplier. There are often cheaper options but time and wasted effort play a part too. I reckon "E" series are being replaced early next year - so was able to pick up one for 2,800 - list is 4,429.
Most other regular items are far cheaper in USA than Australia - most staples - food, beer, gasoline, cigarettes. I would say that university, insurance and women are the more expensive.
I received a payout for my software business 6 months before the 2008 Financial crisis. I put money in 5 year 5% CD's(fixed term deposits). The manager laughed at me and said - "you really think interest rates will stay that lo for 5 years". I said I don't know but I am happy with it. Now it is under 1%. In any case during my panic in 2008 I pulled them out early took a hit(lost all interest) and sent the money to NAB in Australia. have been getting 6% since. And have been incredibly lucky with the exchange rate - sent around .80 cents to the dollar and have been giving it back to Westmarine at around 1.03.
Having said that - USA is 1% Australia is about 6%. I have no trust in either of these banks. ANd the Australian dollar could easily drop back to reality - in the .70c range. Thereby nullifying the risk reward rate of 6% over the US$.
Some country offering 14%? - well be very careful. If you only live there and buy there than the exchange rate doesn't matter - but buying boat stuff will. And then there is the safety of the principle. Will it be returned? Does they country have different laws for foreigners such as Thailand? This money could be lost so easily. risk/reward...
I pay taxes in USA on the interest income I make in Australia. But, I do not double pay due to tax amnesties. Are you sure there is not tax liability back in the western countries for Foreign interest earned?

It also interesting to hear people debate the 2 party system - as if anything any politician does makes any difference. And get defensive and personal about "their"" party (team) - divide and rule. And Australian's are really ruled...
cheers

[RigelKent]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

...
Sadly a lot of our steel and ally rolling mills have lacked maintenence and skill levels, if Australia were to value add there would be massive capital investment required and sadly our labour costs would screw the whole exercise...China is the new Japan just as we supplied raw materials to that market then so too we will to China. We are just the consumers our skills are being lost and thats a real worry.

Yes but are the costly import items we are discussing coming from China or somewhere else? Manufacturing to add value to our natural resources doesn't mean we can't be selective in what we import. If a relationship with China makes sense that's great but what about the other imports that that are making prices here unreasonable?

The infrastructure and training costs would be good investment of the boom.

Originally Posted by At sea

That's good in theory but it's pretty much impossible for Aus to turn ore into toasters cheaper than China can do it.

On the bright side, it's the seemingly ever-cheaper Chinese goods that have allowed solid growth in Aus without inflation or a wages blowout.

I mean, throwaway drills at $30 - we could never do that. No need to rock the boat.

That's true, but again a selective import/export policy could maintain the benefits with local manufacture taking up the slack where imports are extortionate.

[Wand]

Originally Posted by AllezCat

It also interesting to hear people debate the 2 party system - as if anything any politician does makes any difference. And get defensive and personal about "their"" party (team) - divide and rule. And Australian's are really ruled...

it's always amazing to me that people who enjoy all the benefits and privileges and freedoms that come with living in a democracy can be so dismissive and/or ill-informed about their representative parliaments.

Of course politicians make a difference - parliament is the place where the nation's laws are made and it's the politicians who make those laws.

If those on opposing sides of the political divide get into heated debate at times, it's because the 'progressive' and 'conservative' sides in all modern western democracies have different views about how their country should be shaped and how the future should look.

But much better to debate those issues than be too lazy and/or cynical to bother contributing imho. It's just that this site is not the one where that debate should be held.

[AllezCat]

Originally Posted by At sea

it's always amazing to me that people who enjoy all the benefits and privileges and freedoms that come with living in a democracy can be so dismissive and/or ill-informed about their representative parliaments.

Of course politicians make a difference - parliament is the place where the nation's laws are made and it's the politicians who make those laws.

If those on opposing sides of the political divide get into heated debate at times, it's because the 'progressive' and 'conservative' sides in all modern western democracies have different views about how their country should be shaped and how the future should look.

But much better to debate those issues than be too lazy to bother contributing imho. It's just that this site is not the one where that debate should be held.

I am not lazy. I will not contribute to a corrupt system - I am politically awake.

I have spent much time in places like thailand - very corrupt - and openly corrupt - and everyone knows it and plays along with the game.
Interesting in the west - many people believe their "democratic" system is the best and "not" corrupt.
Not sure if they have lobbyists in Australia/England...

[AllezCat]

For the record I do not favor USA over AUstralia. Both are great in many ways. I do not think Australia is a **** hole, but can be frustrating in many areas.
Was it kiosaki that said "Australia is a great place to be poor"?
this is very true. You do not want to be poor in USA.
Being poor in SEA is not comparable...

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by RigelKent

Yes but are the costly import items we are discussing coming from China or somewhere else? Manufacturing to add value to our natural resources doesn't mean we can't be selective in what we import. If a relationship with China makes sense that's great but what about the other imports that that are making prices here unreasonable?............

............. again a selective import/export policy could maintain the benefits with local manufacture taking up the slack where imports are extortionate.

I am in favour of Globalisation, but same as Capitalism (which I also favour - for pragmatic reasons) cannot be left untamed.

Given that China are now in the WTO can't simply raise tarrifs or block certain goods at whim. Only by negotiation.......but what can be done fairly easily (to level the playing field a bit more) is to require not only that the goods are to the safety standards applicable in the (Western) markets (as at present) - but also that the Workers have the same working conditions / terms & conditions enjoyed by there Western counterparts (with the cost of inspections born by the manufacturer). Admittedly won't mean that the cost of Workers will level out, but would tip the balance in certain cases, especially over the medium to longer term.

In regard to Western Democracy, the principal purpose of it is simply to allow the peaceful transfer of power between those who historically would have fought for it (even in the old days of Kings etc they were beholden to the same sort of folk as our current Politicians are) - you don't get to the top politically without being bought and paid for.

Also provides a route to the top for folk who would otherwise be stirring up the peasants to do so.

What's gone wrong in the West is that the Treasury(s) have been looted more than usual (it was always thus - what makes the West "Civilised" is that our corruption is done legally) and the capacity to replenish (by the peasantry) has been vastly reduced. In the good old days you would simply invade somewhere with nice stuff

But if it also gives folk a warm fuzzy feeling casting a vote, then all the better

[Ex-Calif]

Originally Posted by AllezCat

For the record I do not favor USA over AUstralia. Both are great in many ways. I do not think Australia is a **** hole, but can be frustrating in many areas.
Was it kiosaki that said "Australia is a great place to be poor"?
this is very true. You do not want to be poor in USA.
Being poor in SEA is not comparable...

Excellent...

It is pretty easy to be rich anywhere. If you're poor you definitely don't want to live in an 3rd world country. US is bad enough but try being poor in India. Puts the price of boat parts in perspective...