Insurance: Survey and rig inspection for new boat???

[svbravo]

We are shopping for insurance for a new boat, scheduled for launch in 2 months. The carriers we have spoken with all ask:
-Has the boat had a professional rig inspection? (provide copy and details)
-Has the boat had a professional survey? (provide copy and details)

I know that these questions are primarily aimed at 2nd hand boats. But I'm not sure how best to address the questions. Obviously the rig is being built by professional riggers (Sparcraft), and I hadn't planned on a new boat survey, as we've been intimately involved with the build. I'd hate to have the request for a quote be either round filed due to lack of survey and inspections, or put into the high risk category because of this.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

[sailorboy1]

There’s some logic in getting an indecent survey on a new construction boat as a second look to the builder. The cost would to be almost nothing compared to a brand new boat.

[Smokeys Kitchen]

Sorry to ask the obvious question, but the insurers you have been talking to all realize that this is a new boat not used, correct?

I have not heard of this requirement, especially the rigging inspection, on a new build.

The reason I emphasize this is due to experience of a person or group giving the impression that they have heard you or that they understand what you are asking.

In my past life I worked for a large manufacturer that was going to start sending product requirements offshore and not true engineering specs as they had done for decades. The many meetings I was in had representatives of the company we were going to send the requirements to in attendance as well. During the entire time of the discussions, they would nod in agreement to everything that was said, and we though that meant that they were agreeing to the concepts. It was only when we started asking for product delivery schedules that they came back and asked for engineering specs (as they had always received).

The nod in this culture only means that I heard you - not that I agree with you. Product delivery was 2 years late...

The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place.

George Bernard Shaw

[Scott Berg]

I always suggest that a new boat be surveyed by a qualified, independent surveyor whenever possible. It helps resolve warranty issues before they become problems. As for the rig I think proof that it's new will suffice.

[svbravo]

While I don’t disagree that a survey of a new boat could definitely save headaches down the road, we’ve decided to do without. My experience with surveyors on our older boats has been very mixed. In fact I’ve been more surprised by what they miss than anything really constructive which they’ve offered. I’ve made several trips to France during the build to review the work and meet with various trades. We will pick up the boat at the yard, not ship it sight unseen.

This is our first new build, however. So I’m interested if this requirement for a survey and rig inspection of a new boat is common, or if it is based on either a misunderstanding that this is a new boat, or simply they’ve been sending the wrong forms.

I hate to just simply check a box saying that the boat has no current survey and face the consequences. Others who have built new boats must’ve dealt with this before?

A call to the brokers this week may shed some light on the best approach, but I thought I’d get some ducks in a row before picking up the phone.


Cheers

[NorthernMac]

I’ve seen certified aircraft delivered with issues, I’d could understand wanting to make sure someone qualified gave it a one over before they take the risk, actually probably a good idea to have it included in the sale regardless of insurance, fresh independent set of eyes is always good

[blueblaze]

Hi, I am a cruiser and insurance agent, the companies I work with do not require a survey on a new boat. If you want to talk email me at laura@jdcmarineservicea.com.

[Michael Pope]

As a Builder I have on occasion insisted on both a hull and rig survey. I have also paid for those surveys on occasion or shared the cost with the new owner.
It is an insurance against damage to the relationship between owner and builder which when you are building custom designs and rigs is of Paramount value.
On the other hand I have too frequently refused access to some surveyors
whom I considered as a waste of time or incompetent.
A good surveyor that has a long career can always offer constructive
advise about minor or major issues. Nobody is perfect So no boat will be perfect.
Why not ask the builder for his comments!! Mike Pope

[double u]

check with Preuss Yachtversicherungen - Vermittler fuer Yachtversicherung weltweit
I am sure English language is ok with them

[Fore and Aft]

I often survey new boats. Two weeks ago I surveyed a very nice new Schionning cat. There was nothing wrong with it, but I could see they were short one winch and will be interested to see if they install another winch after going sailing.
You are insuring an expensive item so you can hardly blame the insurance company for wanting an independent third party opinion. Often it is new home built boats I survey..........
Cheers

[svbravo]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

There was nothing wrong with it, but I could see they were short one winch and will be interested to see if they install another winch after going sailing.
You are insuring an expensive item so you can hardly blame the insurance company for wanting an independent third party opinion. Often it is new home built boats I survey..........
Cheers

While again, I don't doubt that another pair of eyes can always discover an otherwise unknown defect on a new boat, one factor in our favor here is that we'll be launching the boat where she's built in France, and living aboard at that marina for approx 6 weeks after, installing some additional gear (watermaker, HF radios, etc), as well as doing day sails around the Brittany area. So its likely that most defects will be found during this shakedown, with the builders yard nearby. (Also, the boat is being built by a very experienced yard, well known for building expedition style sailboats, not a DIY owner build).

The real question is will we be REQUIRED by the insurance carriers to get the rig inspected and the boat surveyed? I'm guessing that this is on the forms because they are intended for used boats instead of new. Will hopefully get some answers this week from the carriers.

Cheers!

[CarlF]

I wouldn't assume that the insurance company is expecting a "yes". Nor that they feel a survey is necessary.

it's likely just on the list of questions they ask everyone with this size/value boat.

Insurance companies love to insure large new boats - loss rates are low because owners typically take great care of a new boat and nothing is worn out - and premiums are high.

You can be sure that sales will be leaning on underwriting to get the business.

[boatpoker]

Over 5,000 surveys performed and I've never heard of an underwriter asking for a survey on a new boat. That being said, Sharon and I survey two or three new boats per year and routinely find close to just as much wrong as with a 20 yr. old boat.