Is liveaboard lifestyle a dying lifestyle

[SV THIRD DAY]

Every time I hear this meme about the cruising and/or liveaboard lifestyle dying I see more of the "its not like it was years ago" than any real evidence that it's dying. Being a gear seller, sales have increased every year from 2007, in some years double digit. Marina's are full. Anchorages are full. Boat Builders can't keep up with demand for some models. The used Boat market for quality boats is good.

There is just something about the Cruising and Liveaboard fleet that is always talking about some mythical "Good old days" but they didn't have expresso machines aboard in the "Good old days"...these ARE The GOOD Days folks! So let someone else worry why you enjoy the Cruising/Liveaboard lifestyle!

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

always talking about some mythical "Good old days"

The older you get the more golden the "good old days" become, and the dumber the people younger than you become.

Personally the only thing I can of that was better 30 years ago is that I was younger.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by Chotu

This is a great sub topic.

Can anyone come up with a boat that doesn't need marinas?

I'm sure stumped.

Where I am, there is no such thing! for a solid 1/3 of the year, the water gets very hard. Kinda need the marinas and bubbling to make it through the winter!

[Augi]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Where "off the beaten path" can you find a marina with all the amenities for well less than $1000 a month, and how many months in advance would you have to pay to get that rate?

SailorBoy mentioned Gulfport, and that's a possibility, but hurricane alley and Mississippi bay depths kinda turn us off. But hey let's be open minded.

Rio Dulce is approx. $250 a month in most marinas(regardless of LOA or number of hulls). Cost of labor is a small fraction of what it is in the First World. So basic grunt work you need done you can have done for pennies on the dollar. The marinas will keep your boat clean inside and out, aired out for $50 a month. There are a couple of pretty good boatyards that probably can do most technical work you cannot or don't want to do yourself for approx. 30% less than in the First World. There is a West Marine distributor. Most things from outside the country you will pay duty on plus a 12% VAT. But there are ways to legally offset the 12% VAT that requires some paper work.

Rio Dulce is 20 miles inland(virtually hurricane worry free), with lots of quiet places to anchor in flat water. Fresh water means your bottom does not get as fouled. And what you find on your bottom comes off with little effort.

It is possible to have a small waterfront house with a dock, electricity, air conditioning, etc. for $75K. You can have a waterfront palace with dock for $250K. Both of the above likely will not be accessible by car. So if you like Rio Dulce as a base, depending on what kind of sailing you want to do, you potentially don't need as capable / comfortable / as big boat. For example if you just wanted to cruise to Belize, Yucatan, Mx, and maybe passage to the Bay Islands or Cuba most only need no more than a 35 ft boat for two people. A lot of people would be comfortable on 27-30 ft boat for 2-3 weeks at a time, knowing you have a sweet little house to go back to.

Minimal immigration and bureaucratic issues. If you over stay(more than 6 months) your visitors visa you pay a small fine per day when you leave and are welcome back anytime. Same thing for the boat. The boat is supposed to leave every two years for 3 months. But the cost of keeping the boat for more than 2 years is minimal and if you don't formally pay to stay more than two years the fine you pay on the way out is the same as if you had formally paid to stay more than two years.

There are several excellent resorts where you can dock and have an excellent meal or where friends and family can stay when they come to visit. Same thing goes for the Marinas. The most you will pay is $125 a night for some luxury. $50 a night for a clean, comfortable place, with air con., pool, good food.

Except for Easter Week and Christmas/ New Years Rio Dulce tends to not be crowded waters.

Lots of nooks and crannies to explore on the river, Lake Isabal and Golfito in protected waters. Being able to speak basic Spanish helps and makes things more fun but not essential. So it potentially is a great place for a newbie to start the pirate life. Most afternoons there are at least there 10-15 knot winds.

Guatemala City(and GUA International Airport) with everything a medium size city has in the USA is a 6 hour bus ride away, including excellent medical and dental care at a fraction of the cost of the USA. Probably the biggest negative is the road between Rio Dulce and Guatemala City is dangerous because if all the truck and poor shape the road is in in many spots. The solution is take the bis or fly from Puerto Barrios which is 1 hour away from Rio Dulce. Another way to look at it is based on what you save versus the First World you can go the 185 miles by helicopter between Rio Dulce, Antigua and Guatemala City.

I am sure there are similar options around the world similar to the above all with their own set of trade offs.

[Amapola]

We are "part-time" cruisers who maintain a land home in SW Florida. We have cruised and lived aboard 3-6 months per year for the last 20+ years. There are many of us out there who do the same and love the life style.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

heck that's only the upper end of "normal" daily transient rates

Try NYC $4-8 per ft per night USD!!!

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

There is just something about the Cruising and Liveaboard fleet that is always talking about some mythical "Good old days" but they didn't have expresso machines aboard in the "Good old days"...these ARE The GOOD Days folks! So let someone else worry why you enjoy the Cruising/Liveaboard lifestyle!

Every day is what you make of it...
...So its all good!

While Cruising the world in the 1980's was far more challenging and the amenities Spartan by comparison to today's GPS Precise, Solar Powered, Touch Screened, Cappuccino Existence .... we have paid a "Progress Price" that newer generation cruisers adjust to far more easily.

Missing:
Pristine beaches, no plastics.
Teaming Sea and Bird life, no empty oceans
Secluded anchorages. No regulations
Tranquility, No Internet

We are so lucky to still set sail with Family and make great memories, BUT, we have lost some precious components from the 'good ole days' [emoji26]

I agree, don't dwell on it, but why not remember and salute, what was once a less spoiled lifestyle?

[jimisbell]

Originally Posted by Chotu

This is a great sub topic.

Can anyone come up with a boat that doesn't need marinas?

I'm sure stumped.

The Aircraft carrier Lexington in Corpus Christi doesnt need one. It is set in concrete on the bottom of the bay. Also my old 44' ketch is now set with its keel in the dirt 10 feet above the beach on a Missouri lake (lake cabin now)

[theDangerz]

Originally Posted by resoluute

We are getting ready to buy another boat after having been out of cruising for 6 yrs, we are in our late 50's and hoping to age out on boat, but wondering from people out there doing it now, if this is a lifestyle on life support.

Im confused. You know what you want and are in the process of doing it.
Why does it matter whether other are continuing to? Besides.. if less people are doing it, doesn't that make it better for those of us who are??

Also, for what its worth after a season spent island hopping south through the caribbean... there are countless beautiful anchorages just waiting for you.

[david78212]

I think it's mostly dying out in the U.S. simply because of how materialistic people have become... You can't live on a boat AND have all the crap you want. It's so easy now to have EVERYTHING you want and MORE!!!

Let's not even get started on the positive I.D. thing or real I.D. or whatever they call it... It's even adversely affecting R.V.ers in the negative making it harder and harder to not have a place to call homebase... and a LOT of insurance companies MAKE you have a Dr. you must go to to get refereed to anybody else. E.R. visits are becoming costly and most won't even cover it if you're not near home...mine is a $500 deductible to begin with, and that's Blue Cross Blue Shield.
The U.S. as a whole is making harder and harder to NOT have a real address. Pair that will just how materialistic people have become overall and a boat doesn't stand a chance, with size and weight limitations being a factor.

Just a thought.

[Supers0nic]

Perhaps the infrastructure that supports liveaboards is shrinking. That’s because the simplest way to control us is to eliminate us. But as the world changes, I am observing an increase in people seeking an alternative life style.

[Caravela1986]

When we first bought our boat, a Tashiba 36, we cruised NE waters as live boards based out of Portsmouth RI then Bristol RI prior to full time retirement. Then one more year in NE waters before departing Norfolk VA w/the Caribbean 1500 to Virgin Gorda. We were live aboard cruisers for 14 years hauling out in Trinidad, Curacao, Cartagena, and finals Rio Dulce Guatemala.
We never sold our home in NJ where we returned each May then back aboard in October. We needed one month hauled out somewhere out of the hurricane season according to our insurance company policies. We anchored out...........just about every Island in the Caribbean and did not stay in marinas. We took on fresh supplies including potable water every 3 weeks or so.
Gasoline for the dinghy engine every 9-10 weeks or so. Diesel fuel once a year.

We did it and encourage others to do the same. We encourage you to join Seven Seas Cruising Association and become Commodores welcoming others to the lifestyle. Attend their gams to discuss issues & to greet others.

Age and health issues have caught up with us and we can no longer enjoy the lifestyle. Our boat is listed for sale. Send me a private message for details.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by david78212

The U.S. as a whole is making harder and harder to NOT have a real address.

This is not a difficult obstacle to overcome.
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/....php?p=2795620

Yes voluntary simplicity and frugality are counterculture, but I think are to some extent growing even among relatively wealthy segments.

Those that think a nomadic lifestyle are a solutiin to housing costs becoming unaffordable are going to find things getting harder, that is true.

At least living overseas becomes an easier transition.

[merrydolphin]

Originally Posted by Chotu

This is a great sub topic.

Can anyone come up with a boat that doesn't need marinas?

I'm sure stumped.

Any boat that was designed to cruise. Many modern boat today do not have enough tankage and storage. These are basic to avoiding marinas. My Cal 2-46 has 270 gal diesel, 220 gal water and tons ( literally) on storage, including an efficient and big enough marine fridge/freezer. The other part of the equation is a good quality planing dingy (I prefer ribs). This allows you to anchor out in remote and or better protected areas and dingy in to civilization and supplies. The rest is just proper equipment: solar, wind gen, watermaker (if in drier area). With these amenities and a boat purpose built for cruising you should rarely need a marina. We usually only take marinas (other than a quick stop for fuel or an emergency) about once a year. ( and not every year).
When you see a boat who’s decks are loaded with jerry jugs of water, and diesel, you know that they are not designed for serious cruising. Take an Island Packet 38, a boat marketed as a serious cruiser. 56 gal of diesel (are they serious?). Compare to, say a Caliber 40 LRC. (Both boats about the same displacement) 240 gals diesel. They are serious. You can make water (and catch it). You can’t make diesel. A good spare parts and hardware/tools are also essential. We sometimes stay a year or more with nearly NO civilization ( as we know it). Again any proper cruiser properly equipped can do it.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We don’t like staying in marinas period.

1. We find the checking in and out of marinas to be a waste of time..

2. Don’t like being so close to others we can hear them fart.

3. Enjoy daily swims right off the boat in pristine waters.

4. Don’t need air conditioning in anchorages because we get a daily sea breeze unlike in hot stuffy marinas.

5. Zero daily cost for anchorages

6. Enjoy the solitude and privacy anchorages offer instead of being on display 24/7 in marinas.

To each their own... we prefer anchorages over marinas for many reasons. You prefer marinas because they offer electric hook up for your air conditioner. There’s no right or wrong answer, there’s many ways to cruise.

Keno..