I'm a little frustrated

[TaoJones]

Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler

. . .The area I sail is so frustratingly fickle with wind, that you get into a good breeze, Raise the main and then while trying to catch your breath again, the wind dies. So we don't raise it till we have traveled some 35Nm to open water to sail. It's either that, or sit waiting for breezes and take an entire day to travel the same distance it takes only 30minutes under power.

Wheels, do you have some kind of Kiwi Warp Drive setting on your diesel?! Perhaps you have a Cigarette with a telescoping mast! Or is it possible that you actually travel three point five nautical miles to open water in thirty minutes under power before sailing?

TaoJones

[rebel heart]

Originally Posted by slomotion

There are an infinite variety of cruising styles and none of them deserve contempt. If you are talking about cruisers as distinguished from other sailors, then most of them are 50-70 years old. And this is the biggest reason for the floating condo trend. We're old and set in our ways. Yes, full time liveaboard cruising necessarily involves downsizing and simplifing your lifestyle, but the gray hairs demand a certain comfort level that we would have laughed at 20 years ago. We want to be as self sufficient as possible, but we don't do camping anymore. Yes, simpler is better, but on my next boat I want an icemaker in addition to the refer/freezer. If it breaks and I can't fix it myself, I'll pay someone else to do it. Of course, we will also have a watermaker. We had one 6 years ago when we were only 52. I've done all the jerry jugging I care to do; our cruising style requires lots of water and these devices are high maintenance; but it's worth it to us.

This is one of the most sound and reasonable ways I've seen it put. I'm younger, and don't mind sweating the problems out a little more. One of the reasons I like a manual windlass so much is because I get some excercise out of it. Maybe that will change as I get older: entirely possible. Even this boat I have now has more creature comforts than my last one.

The only systemic problem I see with this trend towards floating condos is it tends to put the squeeze on folks that don't have the money. I've seen a lot of new sailors show up in our harbor, and it's really daunting when they see what two retired doctors that sold their homes can dump (money wise) into a Tayana 60'.

It clouds the picture, whether it's boats in the marinas, magazine ads, or the West Marine shelves. It's to the point now where people are saying that you *need* an SSB!

Maybe you agree with it and maybe you don't, but the simple fact of the matter is that the median household income for a sailboat owner here in San Diego now is $210K USD.

In short, in my opinion, there isn't as much emphasis and support for the value / budget sailor as there is for the deep-pockets Tayana crowd.

- Boat yards have less to gain by letting you do your own work. And since there's less people doing it these days, there's less demand, so they just squash it entirely.

- Boat retailers make more margin on doo-dads and gizmos, so their shelves get stocked with those. It's easier for me to find a chart plotter at WM than a cotter pin. And the more crap they can fill your boat with (regardless of the item), the more they make.

No lifestyle that doesn't harm another deserves contempt; I'm absolutely with you guys on that, and if I'd had an attitude of otherwise I apologize. But hopefully I'm not the only one that sees that the tone and attitude of the maritime world caters to deep pockets more than budget cruisers.

[Fishspearit]

Originally Posted by never monday

There are incredibly involved drive/power/yacht management systems on the market now and even more coming. The latest and greatest Lagoon is a hybrid diesel drive.
The stated goal of these systems is vessel integration.
We all know from experience that the electrical system is the most temperamental system on our boats, but were making it more complex......where's the logic in that?
Basic mechanical engines are becoming more complex with electronics due to emissions regulations....Then there are smart charger/inverter combinations. All designed so we can "not worry" the computer has control. Well I'm old school, HAL will have as little control of my boat as possible making my life easier thru less junk breaking.

I can't help but be reminded of what Henry Ford once said,

"If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses."

When it's behind us, innovation and change look obvious. When we try to look forward, it's scary and strange and we always have a hard time adopting it until everyone else has proved how reliable it is.

[David M]

Originally Posted by rebel heart

No lifestyle that doesn't harm another deserves contempt; I'm absolutely with you guys on that, and if I'd had an attitude of otherwise I apologize. But hopefully I'm not the only one that sees that the tone and attitude of the maritime world caters to deep pockets more than budget cruisers.

Your right Rebel. It does not just apply to the cruising world. It applies to everything. People who have businesses need to cater to those with the bucks...or do poorly or even go out of business. It's unfortunate for those who are scraping by. I don't think that it will ever change. It's how capitalism works and therefore how businesses have to operate. I definitely sympathize.

BTW, the last yard I hauled out in I had to get a letter that got them as additionally insured on the policy, so that I could work on the boat.

[Weyalan]

I am continually amazed by the things that people find "essential". I'm not just talking on the water, but off the water as well. Take a look at the average kitchen these days; chances are it will be full of gadgets that rarely, if ever, get used. Why would you own a dedicated electric pizza maker if you already have an oven? Why have a George Foreman grill if you have a grill on your stove? Why would you own a popcorn making machine if you own a cooking pot with a lid? And that is just the kitchen! I mean, if that is how you make yourself happy, for sure, knock yourself out. Personally, I get happiness out of simplifying my life, not complicating it!

[rebel heart]

In Nigel Calder's book Cruising Handbook, he states that microwave ovens are on the verge of becoming essential equipment. Page 137.

I never even had one when I lived on land; what the hell do I need one on the boat for?

[Vasco]

On my CS36M without an inverter the microwave becomes a breadbox when we go cruising. On my Beneteau with inverter the microwave is an efficient energy saver, a couple of minutes @90 amps and the veggies are done. Much more utilitarian than the hair dryer. Yes, we have one, low wattage and only used (not by me) when the KISS is cranking out the amps. After all, would you go to the beach party with wet hair?