In The News

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by GordMay

7 dead, 21 missing after tour boat sinks in Hungary
Rescue workers scoured the Danube River in downtown Budapest on Thursday for 21 people missing after a sightseeing boat carrying South Korean tourists sank in a collision with a larger cruise ship during an evening downpour.
Seven people have been confirmed dead and seven have been rescued, Hungarian officials said. Police have launched a criminal investigation.
More ➥ https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/tour-b...gary-1.5155324

UPDATE:

Cruise ship captain arrested as search for 21 still missing in Danube continues
Rescue crews in Hungary's capital were preparing to raise a sightseeing boat from the bottom of the Danube River Thursday as search teams scoured the waters for 21 people missing after the vessel, packed with South Korean tourists, collided with a cruise ship and sank.
Late Thursday in Budapest, police arrested the captain of the cruise ship, the Viking Sigyn. The 64-year-old, identified as a Ukrainian citizen from Odessa, was detained for reckless misconduct in waterborne traffic leading to mass casualties, police said on their website.
☞ https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hunagr...orea-1.5156147

[hpeer]

Bill Nye’s F-bomb rant. (Not a lot of ambiguity here. Straight talk, like calling “spying” “spying”, unpopular but honest)

“Grow up,” he said, injecting some more language that wouldn’t fly in public broadcasting. “You’re not children anymore. I didn’t mind explaining photosynthesis to you when you were 12. But you’re adults now, and this is an actual crisis; got it?”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/beta.wa...outputType=amp

[transmitterdan]

I don’t know how many honorary degrees Bill Nye has but I seem to recall from my days working on a Carl Sagan project that Bill has a BS engineering degree from Cornell. Does that make him a climate expert? We’ve heard that we are only allowed to listen to climate experts. If a BSME degree is all the qualification needed then a lot more people will be allowed to have climate opinions.

[GordMay]

Protected areas worldwide are shrinking
A large international team of researchers reports that the amount of land designated as protected around the globe is shrinking. In their paper [*1], published in the journal Science, the researchers describe their study of protected lands over the past 200 years, and what they found.
They found that approximately 90 percent of the land downgraded in the U.S. over the past two centuries, happened over just the past 20 years. And that approximately 99 percent of such land was downgraded so that it could be used for industrial purposes.
Lisa Naughton-Treves and Margaret Buck Holland with the University of Wisconsin and the University of Maryland, respectively, have published a Perspective piece [*2] on the work done by the team, in the same journal issue. They note that not all downgrades are a threat to biodiversity. They suggest that, rather than look at downgraded land totals, environmentalists need to look at how land is being used.

“The uncertain future of protected lands and waters” ~ Rachel E. Golden Kroner et al.
[1] ☞ https://science.sciencemag.org/content/364/6443/881


“Losing ground in protected areas?” ~ Lisa Naughton-Treves & Margaret Buck Holland
[2] ☞ https://science.sciencemag.org/content/364/6443/832

[jimbunyard]

Originally Posted by StuM

...used model simulations..."

As you do from the time you get up until the time you go to sleep, for every action you take in your life, or any thought you have...

Same old, same old.

As if confirmation is a bad thing (leaving aside what a statement like this says about the stater...)

Have you been on a boat yet?

And this has what exactly to do with this thread?


In response to this post, I shouldn't hit the '' icon in the lower left corner for possibly violating parts of point two under the 'Be Courteous' section of the 'rules', and definitely violating points four and twelve under the same section, why exactly?

[jimbunyard]

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

I don’t know how many honorary degrees Bill Nye has but I seem to recall from my days working on a Carl Sagan project that Bill has a BS engineering degree from Cornell. Does that make him a climate expert? We’ve heard that we are only allowed to listen to climate experts. If a BSME degree is all the qualification needed then a lot more people will be allowed to have climate opinions.

Then don't listen to him. There are at least tens of thousands of 'credentialed' scientists who are saying the same thing (and the ones who are 'best credentialed' are saying much worse).

[StuM]

Originally Posted by GordMay

They found that approximately 90 percent of the land downgraded in the U.S. over the past two centuries, happened over just the past 20 years. And that approximately 99 percent of such land was downgraded so that it could be used for industrial purposes.

Not according to what I read in your link!
What I read was:

From 1944 to 2017, the U.S. government proposed at least 737 PADDD events in 426 PAs, which, if enacted, would affect 402,414 km2 of protected lands. The government introduced 90% of U.S. PADDD proposals since 2000, 99% of which were associated with industrial-scale development. For instance, proposals in 2011 and 2015 to authorize infrastructure construction for national security purposes on public lands “within 100 miles” (161 km) of Mexico or Canada would affect 191 PAs (11).

Hmmm,

"proposal" <> "downgrade". How many were enacted?

Does "infrastrucure construction for national security purposes" (e.g. a dirt road along the border?) = "industrial-scale development" ?

It's worth noting that:

Most U.S. PADDD events (n = 186) resulted from a 2016 National Park Service regulation provisionally allowing Native American tribes to harvest plants for traditional subsistence purposes if the activity will have “no significant ecological impact”

Is that also industrial-scale development"?

Then again, raw PADDD counts are deceptive. For instance, from the same link:

"Of the enacted PADDD events in Amazonia, 5% were simultaneously offset with upgraded or expanded protections (table S23), whereas 67% were later reversed through revocations of downgrades or establishments of new PAs"

It's also worth considering the first sentence in the other link:


"After 30 years of rapid growth in terrestrial protected areas, especially in the biodiverse tropics, expansion has slowed" (i.e. still expanding!)

[transmitterdan]

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Then don't listen to him. There are at least tens of thousands of 'credentialed' scientists who are saying the same thing (and the ones who are 'best credentialed' are saying much worse).

Jim,

There aren’t 10,000 climate scientist in the entire world let along 10’s of thousands.

[transmitterdan]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Protected areas worldwide are shrinking
A large international team of researchers reports that the amount of land designated as protected around the globe is shrinking. In their paper [*1], published in the journal Science, the researchers describe their study of protected lands over the past 200 years, and what they found.

Seriously? The claim is that today there is less government designated protected land area than in 1819.

That is utter rubbish. There was hardly any protected land in the world in 1819.

The US is twice as large today as it was in 1819. So the US could never have had as much protected land then as it does today.

[transmitterdan]

If the Bay Area keeps driving live aboard boaters off the water there may be more homeless living in trees. Seriously....


https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/20...n-tree-houses/

[SailOar]

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

Seriously? The claim is that today there is less government designated protected land area than in 1819.

That is utter rubbish. There was hardly any protected land in the world in 1819.

The US is twice as large today as it was in 1819. So the US could never have had as much protected land then as it does today.

What you quoted from GordMay's post does not support your assertion. Is there another quote you could supply that would support your statement?

[a64pilot]

As far as protected land, what is interesting to me is how much of it that is completely inaccessible to the public because it’s completely surrounded by private land.
Makes for a very nice back yard for a privileged few
https://www.dailyyonder.com/millions...8/09/05/27378/

[StuM]

Originally Posted by SailOar

What you quoted from GordMay's post does not support your assertion. Is there another quote you could supply that would support your statement?

"After 30 years of rapid growth in terrestrial protected areas, especially in the biodiverse tropics, expansion has slowed"

[SailOar]

Originally Posted by StuM

"After 30 years of rapid growth in terrestrial protected areas, especially in the biodiverse tropics, expansion has slowed"

Apparently I'm extra-dense tonight. What relevance is your quote to transmitterdan's statement that:

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

Seriously? The claim is that today there is less government designated protected land area than in 1819....

I'm asking TransmitterDan to support his assertion that it was stated in the articles posted by GordMay "that today there is less government designated protected land area than in 1819." Maybe that claim was indeed made. I missed it, and am asking for a reference for it.

[GordMay]

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