Most users ever online was 6,588, 27-12-2019 at 09:52.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Delancey

I find value in different opinions, like for example different opinions about anchors. I have learned a lot from them.

The site is in decline, that’s a fact based on the numbers. Obviously the owners revenue is declining too, but their business their rules. I just feel it’s unfortunate for the sailing community at large.

Your interpretation of scant data seems highly biased. From your previous posts here, you appear annoyed that certain poster have been shown the virtual door, or have chosen to stop posting. As I said, I know a couple that you reference, and I can attest to why they were labelled persona non grata.

As one with as long a pedigree on this site, but with a lot more involvement, I think you are simply in error in your observations and interpretations. Citing snapshot user stats says very little. And even if CF is loosing members, there are multiple factors which come into play to explain this.

What is curious is, why are you persisting in this thread, or indeed on CF? Do you see it as a personal mission to rescue the fallen and return CF to its former glory? Make CF Great Again...? Since it appears to have fallen so far in your esteem, why bother?

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Delancey

I can see a few spare diehards still linger, there used to be a ton of really great people here but they all left?

Seems like they all jumped ship about two years ago and took all their knowledge and expertise with them. Sad.

What happened to this place?

It is no longer possible to start a conversation here about anything much to do with sails, or sailing, or rigging, or autopilots. It used to be different. But there are threads that go on for hundreds of posts about marine sanitation, electrical systems, and marina policies.



It is my observation that the advice is worse (in several narrow areas where I have the expertise to know) than several years ago. There are kooks who dispense downright dangerous advice who have set up shop next to people who are knowledgeable but condescending. Why bother.


I get better advice at SA which despite its many flaws is self-policing and intolerant of kooks and fools. The social pecking order there isn't as dysfunctional as the blanket superficial acceptance here brought on by strict enforcement of surface behavioral norms.


We were all new once, I learned a lot, bought a boat, sold it, bought another boat, am selling it, sailed the hell out of both of them. Lots of posters here who will never take those steps. It dilutes the community.

[Shanachie]

Web sites like this are best when you are newish to sailing.


After several years, you know the parameters of the major debates, and you decide which side you're on. The posts start to seem repetitive, and at some point you start to lose interest.


On the other hand, through perceptive reading you can pick up on new ideas and enhance your sailing experience. So you can continue to hang around, even though you don't post as often.


To me, the most aggravating experience is the continual influx of trolls who post idiotic memes. You can always tell. It's their second or third post. They don't know anything about sailing.


Yet they manage to push the right buttons and prompt dozens or hundreds or responses, stimulating themselves and driving people who know better crazy.


I would like to see people unable to start a thread until they've posted 100 or so times. It would eliminate many of the silly topics that distract from real talk about sailing.

[Stu Jackson]

This forum is not in decline.


It is doing well and thriving.


Great helpful people here.


Nice place to be.


Keep up the good work.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Jammer

It is no longer possible to start a conversation here about anything much to do with sails, or sailing, or rigging, or autopilots. It used to be different. But there are threads that go on for hundreds of posts about marine sanitation, electrical systems, and marina policies.



It is my observation that the advice is worse (in several narrow areas where I have the expertise to know) than several years ago. There are kooks who dispense downright dangerous advice who have set up shop next to people who are knowledgeable but condescending. Why bother.


I get better advice at SA which despite its many flaws is self-policing and intolerant of kooks and fools. The social pecking order there isn't as dysfunctional as the blanket superficial acceptance here brought on by strict enforcement of surface behavioral norms.


We were all new once, I learned a lot, bought a boat, sold it, bought another boat, am selling it, sailed the hell out of both of them. Lots of posters here who will never take those steps. It dilutes the community.

Here is just one example of threads that active cruisers might find useful and informative:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3544567

It's just one of many examples of how this forum can be helpful without any need for enforcement of surface behavioral norms.

[Delancey]

Mike, you are exactly one of the “old diehards” referred to in the OP. Didn’t always agree with your opinion but I always respected the hell out of you and was always more than willing to listen to whatever you had to say and give it my consideration. Same is true today.

Throttle back buddy, this ain’t personal between you and me so don’t make it that way. Less online users is not scant or biased data, it comes from the website itself. If you guys want to tell yourselves this site is more alive and vibrant than ever, that’s cool. I only hope you would acknowledge there are a lot of old people here who aren’t getting any younger and when they are gone no one is replacing them.

Sure, the COVID thing happened but it’s not clear to me that there are less people interested in cruising. I rather think it’s the opposite. I am pretty sure the YouTubers all got a huge boost by everyone being locked up.

In my opinion this place used to be better. That’s my opinion. I asked what happened and was told by the Shrew guy to piss off to wherever my friends went. Frankly, this sounds kinda butthurt and is a prime example of the kind of snarky intolerance that turns people away in the first place.

I wish this site could do better and be better but when you start turning people away, they tend not to come back.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Delancey

In my opinion this place used to be better. That’s my opinion. .

OK, I, for one, am listening. How would you improve this forum?

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by Don C L

OK, I, for one, am listening. How would you improve this forum?

If I had an answer to the question I asked in the OP I wouldn’t have asked it. I don’t know what happened to this place. If I had to guess, it would be that someone decided this site had to be some kind of a “safe space” and heavy handed mods kicked out some of the more vibrant people who made it interesting. Once they were gone other vibrant people stopped coming here because it was less interesting.

That’s all I got. In vague numbers it looks like a 30% decline over a two year period.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Don C L

OK, I, for one, am listening. How would you improve this forum?

1) Ask the people who left or dramatically scaled back their posting and writers/authors who choose engage elsewhere. a64pilot up and disappeared one day -- maybe it has nothing to do with CF, but he was among those who routinely made high quality posts. Ask Evans Starzinger who posts here only rarely but quite often in various other forums. There are others.



2) Implement a publicly visible reputational system where people can respond to posts with a like/dislike or upvote/downvote system. They are widely used elsewhere and encourage high quality posts. The "thanks" system here is weak and rarely used.



3) Back off on the swear filter and family-friendly moderation. They turn some valuable contributors off. This isn't 1953 and we're not in 3rd grade -- what are we really trying to achieve?


4) Double down on moderation re proper forum selection. "Boat Ownership & Making a living" is full of posts that don't belong there as is "General Sailing". Consider re-titling some of the forums for clarity. Consider splitting some forums -- for example, VHF/HF/Satellite radio is perhaps deserving of a place separate from "Marine Electronics." Consider having specific forums for electrical troubleshooting and for engine troubleshooting to make these highly repetitive and unsatisfying topics easier to ignore. Experienced forum members benefit most from being able to follow/ignore topic areas of greatest enduring interest to them.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Delancey

In my opinion this place used to be better. That’s my opinion. I asked what happened and was told by the Shrew guy to piss off to wherever my friends went. Frankly, this sounds kinda butthurt and is a prime example of the kind of snarky intolerance that turns people away in the first place.

I wish this site could do better and be better but when you start turning people away, they tend not to come back.

Its what happens when the 'Cancel Culture' arrives.. debate goes out of the window and abuse and slander become the norm..
As you said, many have moved on because of it.. MarkJ, DOJ, Coop, A64pilot and others... says a lot when even Mod's throw in the towel.

[GordMay]

Even though we have over two hundred thousand members [ 208,017], I’m always surprised that the number of guests always outnumbers [± 20:1] the number of members [90 members and 2053 guests], currently active on CF.

[sailorboy1]

there was a whole thread a couple years ago on SailNet on why a lot of active members left here and moved there

[CaptTom]

Originally Posted by Jammer

...Implement a publicly visible reputational system where people can respond to posts with a like/dislike or upvote/downvote system. They are widely used elsewhere and encourage high quality posts. The "thanks" system here is weak and rarely used.

Yes!! I've seen this work very effectively elsewhere. No, I'm not a Facebook fan boy who thrives on "likes." I really hated the idea at first. But in a forum like this, being able to offer a simple nod of agreement or appreciation without the overhead of sending a "thanks" message and e-mail would incentivize people to consider the quality of their response before posting.

That said, I have to disagree with the general idea that moderation here is too strict. I don't come here to listen to political opinions, petty bickering or childish outbursts. If suppressing those causes hurt feelings, there are other places on the internet where that sort of thing is welcome and encouraged. The aforementioned Facebook comes to mind. For the record, I don't use FB.

[davil]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

there was a whole thread a couple years ago on SailNet on why a lot of active members left here and moved there

===================================

actually works both ways
I was very active on the SailNet until am not anymore.
remember we have some interaction with you on that forum, mostly we disagreed on some topics but did not reach a personal level, just different opinions.
Yes, moderators have become an important source of discomfort and sometimes "irreconcilable differences", as divorce lawyers will tell.
Have not experienced that level here.
different folks, different songs.

[davil]

Originally Posted by Jammer

1) Ask the people who left or dramatically scaled back their posting and writers/authors who choose engage elsewhere. a64pilot up and disappeared one day -- maybe it has nothing to do with CF, but he was among those who routinely made high quality posts. Ask Evans Starzinger who posts here only rarely but quite often in various other forums. There are others.



2) Implement a publicly visible reputational system where people can respond to posts with a like/dislike or upvote/downvote system. They are widely used elsewhere and encourage high quality posts. The "thanks" system here is weak and rarely used.



3) Back off on the swear filter and family-friendly moderation. They turn some valuable contributors off. This isn't 1953 and we're not in 3rd grade -- what are we really trying to achieve?


4) Double down on moderation re proper forum selection. "Boat Ownership & Making a living" is full of posts that don't belong there as is "General Sailing". Consider re-titling some of the forums for clarity. Consider splitting some forums -- for example, VHF/HF/Satellite radio is perhaps deserving of a place separate from "Marine Electronics." Consider having specific forums for electrical troubleshooting and for engine troubleshooting to make these highly repetitive and unsatisfying topics easier to ignore. Experienced forum members benefit most from being able to follow/ignore topic areas of greatest enduring interest to them.

=======================
a posting with ideas and yet lack of response tantamount to ignoring it, seems most people tend to air frustrations and complaints, pick on individual arguments ignoring a positive posting with possible solutions on how to improve what is perceived a "declining"forum.