Most users ever online was 6,588, 27-12-2019 at 09:52.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by davil

===================================

actually works both ways
I was very active on the SailNet until am not anymore.
remember we have some interaction with you on that forum, mostly we disagreed on some topics but did not reach a personal level, just different opinions.
Yes, moderators have become an important source of discomfort and sometimes "irreconcilable differences", as divorce lawyers will tell.
Have not experienced that level here.
different folks, different songs.

LOL... I too am a SN and SA member, however I stopped going there when things started popping up in the 'Chat Room' like "WTF is Boatman doing here"...

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Jammer

... 2) Implement a publicly visible reputational system where people can respond to posts with a like/dislike or upvote/downvote system. They are widely used elsewhere and encourage high quality posts. The "thanks" system here is weak and rarely used...

I believe we had such a "reputation" ranking system, and abandoned it, early on.

[Delancey]

vBulletin 3 is at EOL and unsupported by the developer, version 3.8.11 received its last update 4 years ago. This site runs on the 3.8.8 Beta 1.


That’s because whoever owns or runs this site doesn’t think the site is worth investing money in to make it better. Prove me wrong.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by CaptTom

Yes!! I've seen this work very effectively elsewhere. No, I'm not a Facebook fan boy who thrives on "likes." I really hated the idea at first. But in a forum like this, being able to offer a simple nod of agreement or appreciation without the overhead of sending a "thanks" message and e-mail would incentivize people to consider the quality of their response before posting...

Just thanked you. Took two clicks, no typing.

[Narfi]

I wonder how many of those 6588 were members, how many were guests, and how many were bots and webcrawlers, and how that compares with today's numbers.

As mentioned above, people who post and read forums are not the same as the people who accomplish all of their human interaction through 5 second video clips. We may not all be 'old' but all here are at least 'older' as a generality.

'Old' people tend to be set in their ways, they know what they know, they believe what they believe and they will tell you the same story about when they did x, back in the day every day of the week if you let them. (Their spouse will interupt them with, "you already told them that!", to which they respond, "what?", which is answered with, "what?" untill you quietly walk away) They are quick to offend and they are quick to be offended, because they are 'old' and they deserve the respect for the life they have lived, they are better than you, they know it and are not afraid to tell you.

Combine that with the pandemic and the politics we have endured these last few years, and the already difficult task of moderating an international site populated by many countries and cultures and generations, and it becomes nearly impossible.

As much as I disagree with the moderators approaches to some topics and the way they treat some people, my hat is off to those of you who have taken on the task.

[Narfi]

Originally Posted by Jammer

2) Implement a publicly visible reputational system where people can respond to posts with a like/dislike or upvote/downvote system. They are widely used elsewhere and encourage high quality posts. The "thanks" system here is weak and rarely used.

This is a slippery slope where the petty thrive.....
As cliché as it may sound in today's culture, buttons for 'agree', 'like', 'winner', 'funny', etc.... without any of the negative options has been a more successful approach in other forums I have used.

I am also hesitant to use the 'thanks' button here, as it is basically just a private message and way overkill for a majority of posts.

Originally Posted by Delancey

vBulletin 3 is at EOL and unsupported by the developer, version 3.8.11 received its last update 4 years ago. This site runs on the 3.8.8 Beta 1.


That’s because whoever owns or runs this site doesn’t think the site is worth investing money in to make it better. Prove me wrong.

I really like XenForo forums, and they have a lot of modern tools for such things.

[davil]

[QUOTE=Narfi;3544848]

'Old' people tend to be set in their ways, they know what they know, they believe what they believe and they will tell you the same story about when they did x, back in the day every day of the week if you let them. (Their spouse will interupt them with, "you already told them that!", to which they respond, "what?", which is answered with, "what?" untill you quietly walk away) They are quick to offend and they are quick to be offended, because they are 'old' and they deserve the respect for the life they have lived, they are better than you, they know it and are not afraid to tell you.
=======================
sorry, missing your point
what is it?
and how applies to the thread

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Delancey

Mike, you are exactly one of the “old diehards” referred to in the OP. Didn’t always agree with your opinion but I always respected the hell out of you and was always more than willing to listen to whatever you had to say and give it my consideration. Same is true today.

Throttle back buddy, this ain’t personal between you and me so don’t make it that way. Less online users is not scant or biased data, it comes from the website itself. If you guys want to tell yourselves this site is more alive and vibrant than ever, that’s cool. I only hope you would acknowledge there are a lot of old people here who aren’t getting any younger and when they are gone no one is replacing them.

Sorry Delancy, I appologise if my critique of your critique came across as a personal attack. In no way was it intended to be. I simply offer a different perspective from someone who joined CF at nearly the same time as you, has seen the same losses of some personalities, and who has been a lot more active over the last few years. I also approach this from a rather extensive experience running and moderating these kinds of online discussion forums, starting back with old BBSs and Usenet groups, all the way through to today.

My experience and observations tells me CF is doing just fine, and is no more, or less, vibrant that it ever has been. That's not to say it is static. It ebbs and flows, just like any club of people, or indeed any human conversation. Sometimes the clamour gets louder, sometimes it shifts around, and sometimes it goes quieter for a while. I've seen this kind of pattern happen here many times now, so I simply don't accept your premise -- but with no personal insult intended.

That's not to suggest CF can't be improved. I've stated here many times that, while I have the deepest respect for the mod team, I also think CF would be improved by allowing members greater freedom to work out issues for themselves.

The policy of CF (one not made by the team) is to maintain a tight reign on certain areas of discussion. My assessment is that this actually leads to greater conflict, not less. And I've told members of the team this many times. But I know this is only my opinion. And I recognize that the mod team answers to a higher power. They do not make the policy, they simply agree to enforce it. This, btw, is one of the reasons I declined the offer to join the mod team. I knew my approach was not aligned.

The use of "likes" and reputation rankings are interesting. I like the "like" on SN, mainly because it allows people to "+1" a comment without wasting screen space.

As for a a user's "reputation" ranking, you can see that in their public profile. It's the little green dots on the right. I see that:

• Yours (Delancey) has 2 dots, and "has been thanked many times."
• Mine (Mike OReilly) has eight dots, and "has much to be proud of," and
• GordMay has 11 dots and, "has been generously thanked."

I forget how one gets these dots, but I think it has to do with the number of thanks one receives. Perhaps one of the Mods can explain it. Maybe if this ranking were made more obvious, it would be of some value. I'm not really convinced though. I think reputations are earned and known online, just as they are in any community. If you are a regular member, you will know who has what reputation.

[Narfi]

[QUOTE=davil;3544862]

Originally Posted by Narfi

sorry, missing your point
what is it?
and how applies to the thread

hmm.. now you have confused me.... it was clear to me, but your confusion also proves my point in a way, that is how forum communication goes. Now I get to choose, will I be offended by you calling me out, or will I assume you are honestly curious? And thus begins the spiral many forums suffer.


'Old people*' are more argumentative, and more prone to having their feelings hurt, and much more likely to hold a grudge. They are less likely to give the benefit of the doubt when typed 'tone' can be ambiguous.
This leads to strife, which leads to sides, which leads to moderators either over or under moderating, which leads to people leaving. (if in fact they are)

As part of the natural cycle of life, the older generations also die off and are replaced with the next generations, who have now been programmed to use different forms of communication than forums.

How does that not directly apply to this thread?

*obviously a generality

[Narfi]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

My assessment is that this actually leads to greater conflict, not less. And I've told members of the team this many times. But I know this is only my opinion.

I agree with Mike here,
In fact, it leads to 'intellectual bullying' which I have seen a lot since joining here. Where people know the rules, and know the lines, and so they know how to push the buttons of those who either do not know the rules or have less self-control, and it becomes a game of bullying or trolling by the 'rule followers' over the 'rule breakers' whom the rules were put in place to protect in the first place.

[davil]

[QUOTE=Narfi;3544888][QUOTE=davil;3544862]

hmm.. now you have confused me.... it was clear to me, but your confusion also proves my point in a way, that is how forum communication goes. Now I get to choose, will I be offended by you calling me out, or will I assume you are honestly curious? And thus begins the spiral many forums suffer.
==============
curious
====================
'Old people*' are more argumentative, and more prone to having their feelings hurt, and much more likely to hold a grudge. They are less likely to give the benefit of the doubt when typed 'tone' can be ambiguous.
This leads to strife, which leads to sides, which leads to moderators either over or under moderating, which leads to people leaving. (if in fact they are)

two points.
Your generalizing what old people are like demonstrates only a rather superficial understanding on what "old people are", unfortunately a common unsupported belief that also goes to the second point of
Ageism, that, is a form of discrimination that permeates all sort of social groups, only based on prejudices and unsupported facts.

If I look at o irrelevant and ongoing fights between posters taking offense, been argumentative and repetitive, seems they are not old but mostly younger, opinionated without supporting facts' generation.
==============================
As part of the natural cycle of life, the older generations also die off and are replaced with the next generations, who have now been programmed to use different forms of communication than forums.

Yes, older generations do die, yet does not mean they are not involved and active participants in life.
There is a substantial body of scientific knowledge on this,will be happy to provide literature on request.[/B]
=============================
How does that not directly apply to this thread?

It doesn't

Sayonara

[Narfi]

Good luck, and a Happy New Year!

[davil]

Originally Posted by Narfi

Good luck, and a Happy New Year!

you too

“hau'oli makahiki hou”

[dannc]

My understanding was that AH64Pilot was selling the boat because of his wife's health issues. Bad knee or some such that made it difficult for her to be on the boat. Figured he stopped posting when he sold the boat. I remember he had a few posts where he mentioned the health issues buried in the conversations. I did not see a Good Bye post, he just seemed to stop posting.

I have seen this on other websites as well. People are very active for YEARS and then suddenly are gone. They have other interests, family issues consume their time, and of course, some die.

On another website, there was a long time poster who lived within 20-30 minutes of me. Always wanted to meet him but never did. He got a fatal, quickly spreading cancer and died quickly. Which is a good thing in some ways but I was never able to meet the guy in person.

I have been on this other website since last century and many of the original posters are still posting. However, many have moved on and some have died.

Tis life.

Later,
Dan

[wingssail]

It is an interesting question: Is CF in decline, indicated by fewer online users and loss of some frequent contributors of years past or is it doing just fine?

And why do people come here and why do they stay (or leave)?

Is it the moderators fault?

I personally have not paid much (any) attention to the number of users. That is not how I measure how well CF is doing. I measure it by the quantity and quality of the comments and responses. From my point of view the forum is doing fine.

There are many reasons why people are on this forum and why they sometimes seem to disappear. My reasons for being here are somewhat different from many: I am interested in sailing, I often have some time on my hands and like reading the threads, AND I am somewhat of an evangelist for a certain type of sailing and sailing boats. You could say opinionated. I like to explain and justify my feelings and I hope that if I do a good job I will persuade others. In other words it gives me a change to lobby for a certain point of view. This forum is my forum to do that. That's just my foolish, perhaps misguided, reasoning for being here. I didn't like the smart ass tone on SA or the flaming I received there when I said something viewed as stupid. It seems like SA is contest to who can be the biggest wise ass. I have not visited Sailnet. Maybe I will to give my viewpoint a wider audience, but for now CF is my home and I like it.

About the moderators, I think they are doing great, though I've been dinged a few times by them for being rude, or violating other rules. I usually know when I am doing it and I am usually expecting them to come down on me when they do. I thank them for doing a tough job.

My participation ebbs and flows depending on how busy I am with my sailing and boat maintenance activities. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the moderators or the other posters or commentors. It's about me and what I have going on in my life.

But that brings me to the issue of certain members who I really have problems with. Arrogance, ignorance, and rudeness knows no bounds in some people. But you find those folks everywhere and I dislike them just as much when I run into them on the dock as I do on CF. We have to accept that they are part of the discussion (unless they persist in bad behavior then it's right to get rid of them). I just find it sad that there are so many true idiots in the world these days.

But I suspect that the OP's real point was sort of an "I told you so". Possibly he had agreement or expressed views similar to some very unpopular members, maybe even felt great sympathy with some of those who were chased away.

Either way, I don't really accept his premise. He is blaming it on the forum when really he should look at who it is who has left (others than those who are just busier now). People are usually ostracized by a community for a reason.

I think CF is doing fine. And to those who couldn't stand the heat and left, good riddance.