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sabray · 02-10-2010, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ

What sounds reasonable to you may not to others...

Mark

So right
At work we shifted the policy in which we were allowed to greet each other. THere was to be no more Fergie Bob dude and what ever. I though this was the dumbest thing Still feal that way except. Their were people who felt strongly their cultures were different. They cried as they tried to explain how this formality was deeply felt. My culture bowed out and for a while everyone was Mr. this Ms. that were kind of back to free choice. Some people need to be one way and others not so much. This debate got real hot amongst the employees. Intuition says that I call my boss Mrs x when thats right and others its first name. In another back round its just plain wrong.Its real hard to decide what is reasonable when cultures mix it up. I would lean tward mixing it up and understand that
"What sounds reasonable to you may not to others..."

MarkJ · 02-10-2010, 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Just so you have no doubt, Mark, I do NOT engage in trolling myself.

I hope I'm one of the "some of them" whom you consider your friend.

Thanks, I think of you as a friend.

So lets look at someone else who just watches these attemps to embarrass someone. Doesnt that make him complicite? Laughing at someone elses embarrassment in front of their friends?

Isn't that why the boy committeed suicide? Not just because of the people who put it on the net but the thought that people all over the world would be laughing at him.

So who killed him? The ones that did it? Or all those complicite?

Mark

**Dockhead** · 02-10-2010, 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ

Thanks, I think of you as a friend.

So lets look at someone else who just watches these attemps to embarrass someone. Doesnt that make him complicite? Laughing at someone elses embarrassment in front of their friends?

Isn't that why the boy committeed suicide? Not just because of the people who put it on the net but the thought that people all over the world would be laughing at him.

So who killed him? The ones that did it? Or all those complicite?

Mark

Well, it's a horrible, sad story. But hard cases make bad law, as they say -- there are unfortunately emotionally vulnerable people who can be driven to suicide or other horrible things by all kinds of circumstances.

For normal people surely at some point everyone has got to be able to say -- like the old general in Good Morning, Vietnam! -- "it's only radio."

Don't you think?

Oh, and I don't just stand by and watch trolls do their work. I'm not a "troll accomplice". I call them on it! Outing them is half the fun in that game. For which I got gently knocked up side the head by a moderator, however.

TaoJones · 02-10-2010, 14:33

Just so everyone is aware, these issues are covered in the Community Rules under the heading Be Ethical:

Quote:

Trolling, cyber-bullying and cyberstalking are NOT allowed and are grounds for account restriction or banishment. Trolling on this board includes posting controversial and often irrelevant or off-topic messages with the intention of (or anticipated result of) baiting other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal, harmonious on-topic discussion, especially when a pattern of such posting is apparent.

It is one of those things where a little may be harmless fun, but which has the potential of escalating into something vicious . . . our policy is that even a little is too much, so it simply is not allowed.

The other side of the issue is "outing" someone in a thread who a member has judged to be guilty of trolling, bullying or stalking. That judgment may very well be correct, but it is not the purview of one member to do this to another. While we do appreciate the assistance of the members in bringing to our attention things like this, the truth is that it isn't always the correct call . . . what may seem to be trolling in the judgment of one member can have, and has had, an innocent explanation.

The team of moderators has become pretty adept at recognizing and dealing with bona fide trolling (and bullying, and stalking), and we have the tools at hand to be effective. We always appreciate a heads up about these things, but without those tools, one member is ill-equipped to moderate another.

The single exception to that is when someone steps over the line in a thread and posts something that just invites conflict - other members will often let the originator of the misguided post know in no uncertain terms that he has stepped out of bounds and all of the moderation necessary has been effectively meted out before we're even aware of the problem, occasionally.

Henry Morgan · 02-10-2010, 15:15

Freedom of speech is everything in a free world as far as I am concerned, it seems only the "civilised" countries that preach this are offended... How ironic! Viva La Trolldom, liven up these old farts...

David_Old_Jersey · 02-10-2010, 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ

So who killed him? The ones that did it? Or all those complicite?

Mark

he did it himself.

(BTW was throwing in a dead gay fella a troll? if so, nice touch

)

Henry Morgan · 02-10-2010, 15:45

Suicide is for the weak. No sympathy, regardless of sitch! Cop out and nothing else...

sabray · 02-10-2010, 16:09

See i could get upset the incident involved an 18 year old and you didn't read the story. So Im not upset and I agree suicide is not a place for sympathy. trolling as I have learned what it is. is different then bullying. As an adult Im happy to stand up for my values that doesn't make bad behavior okay though. here is another example of what can happen when bullying not trolling is unchecked UPDATE: Police say no charges in death of bullied 13-year-old | KGET TV 17

Henry Morgan · 02-10-2010, 16:16

Last time I checked everyones computer has a power switch... Where were her parents? No sympathy, I grew up on the streets and in the school of hard knocks. I pulled myself out of the gutter and have had to endure others "attitudes" all my life... I have my hands, neck and pretty much everywhere else tattooed and I see peoples predjudice regulary, I grew thick skin. Suicide is not an option and the weak way out I see conservative toffs to be the most ignorant, rude and offensive but I don't go all emo and slash up or drink draino!

Anzo · 02-10-2010, 16:33

Trollish-ness is fine by me as long as it's tongue in cheek with no personal attacks. Far more bothersome for me are the 12 star admirals that are just so so serious about everything that they insist everyone else be the same way.

sabray · 02-10-2010, 16:33

Im pretty banged up too but I read the story. Its more complicated then Im a tough ass so you should be too.. I'm a tough ass banged up hard knoch working guy but try not to make things tough on others. I like a little humor now and again but I hope not at others expense. still agree with you on some points

**hpeer** · 02-10-2010, 16:36

Perhaps an ill timed question as I have about had it with a couple of trolls here and elsewhere.

They can, and have been, the death of a forum.

I commend free speech.

But trolls are just abusing everyone else's politeness.

I would like to see them warned, and then banned.

Probably much easier said than done.

Henry Morgan · 02-10-2010, 16:49

As I agree with you on some but hey mate, I grew up till I was 12 in Asia and embrace the taoist path and show compassion, humility and understanding towards people but I have little tolerance for people who are ignorant and think their **** don't stink! I also think we are breeding oversensitive punces... I got in **** down here the other day, there was a 11 yr old kid throwing rocks at the dinghy rack. I told him to piss off before I kicked him up the arse and escorted him to the people looking after him and told them he or them if they promote that behaviour were not welcome here. 5 mins later this huge scottish guy comes barrelling up to me and gets right in my face about it, there were lot's of people around and he was trying to belittle me with words, size and that he was a local waterfront owner. I just said don't pull your **** on me while you can't even control or instill good traights to an 11 yr old. He was all offended. I was made out to be the bad guy and everyone looked at me like I had two heads because I am tattooed and to the point.Turns out he is my good mates housemates step dad and is a **** parent, yeah he provides but is never around to spend time... Too many people with their own bigger issues want to cut down others for their own power trips and it is stupid, I will flame and troll these types on any forum (or reference centre) on principal and I will be the one admin messages saying " you have been told 3 times, there will be no more" but the people who were aloof, rude and ignorant don't get even a friendly how you going pm... Like I said, the rudest, most ignorant and hypocrytical are from developed countries going to war in others countries on principals they can't even embrace in their own day to day existence... And we want more people on this planet???

**Wotname** · 02-10-2010, 17:08

Interesting question and thought provoking replies.

In a sense it is freedom versus censorship and as usual we are all on a different point of the spectrum.

IMO, with freedom comes responsibilities and on this forum, the most important responsibility (again IMO) is to play by the owners rules. We are only here with the permission of the owners as this really is a private space owned by somebody that is open to the public (i.e. non members).

Just a case of: in my house its my rules, in your house its your rules, in public its societies' rules so in the CF house, its CF's rules.