Science & Technology News

[newhaul]

Now let's move to something that people can actually do anything about. Anyone know why this problem has not been dealt with ? It has been anchored and abandoned for 6 years .

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/10/12/m...ntl/index.html

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Now let's move to something that people can actually do anything about. Anyone know why this problem has not been dealt with ? It has been anchored and abandoned for 6 years .

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/10/12/m...ntl/index.html

That ship was being used as a loading platform for oil from Yemen, but operations ceased in 2017 because of the war in Yemen. It's not completely abandoned, it has a skeleton crew aboard, but not enough to keep everything in good condition, and the fighting parties can't find a way to agree to let the 1.1 million barrels of oil get pumped off to tankers.

So, it's a political story, not yet a S & T story... until it becomes an ecological disaster.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

You phrased your question with an unproven assertion. The incidence of harm is not low at all compared to any other vaccine we have ever allowed.

Can you prove that?

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

[.

So, it's a political story, not yet a S & T story... until it becomes an ecological disaster.

That is kind of my point and it should be dealt with before it becomes a real problem

[kayakerChuck]

As someone with a lifelong interest in sociology, I want to express my thanks to all of those who make this the most entertaining discussion on CF.

[Thumbs Up]

Since people (in trials and now out in the general population) have had 2 shots of all the "2-shot" vaccines with very low incidence of harm, is it not logical to think that a 3rd dose of the same vaccine would likewise be well-tolerated?

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Can you prove that?

Evidence is hereby presented for evaluation before the forum to prove that the following inferral, as suggested by Lake Effect is incorrect:
"vaccines with very low incidence of harm"

From the 10/1/2021 release of VAERS data:
Found 111,921 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Serious
https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfi...19)&SERIOUS=ON

From the 10/1/2021 release of VAERS data:
Found 5,819 cases where Location is U.S. States and Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfi...ID19)&DIED=Yes

From the 10/1/2021 release of VAERS data:
Found 16,310 cases where Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died
https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfi...ID19)&DIED=Yes

The plausibility of these of these reports has been evaluated (independently) to be greater than 80%.

Many of the foreign listings are from Pfizer, Moderna, and J&J. They are required by law to post them onto VAERS. There is also a European reporting system as well as several other other countries (including Canada).

The fact that, in the question you had stipulated "(in trials and now out in the general population)" is not only immaterial due to the real world up to date evidence from VAERS and other sources, but trials are being conducted by felons convicted (among other things) of fraudulently marketing pharmaceutical products.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/johns...investigations
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justi...nt-its-history
The trials written and designed by the vaccine manufacturers for their own products should be inadmissible due to flagrant conflicts of interest. And lack of proper control group. The trials were mostly conducted with younger healthy people and don't represent the group most at risk. Any raw data or leaked documents should be admissible as evidence before the cour....forum.

Additional evidence available on request.

[bcboomer]

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

Evidence is hereby presented for evaluation before the forum to prove that the following inferral, as suggested by Lake Effect is incorrect:
"vaccines with very low incidence of harm"



The plausibility of these of these reports has been evaluated (independently) to be greater than 80%.

Many of the foreign listings are from Pfizer, Moderna, and J&J. They are required by law to post them onto VAERS. There is also a European reporting system as well as several other other countries (including Canada).

The fact that, in the question you had stipulated "(in trials and now out in the general population)" is not only immaterial due to the real world up to date evidence from VAERS and other sources, but trials are being conducted by felons convicted (among other things) of fraudulently marketing pharmaceutical products.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/johns...investigations
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justi...nt-its-history
The trials written and designed by the vaccine manufacturers for their own products should be inadmissible due to flagrant conflicts of interest. And lack of proper control group. The trials were mostly conducted with younger healthy people and don't represent the group most at risk. Any raw data or leaked documents should be admissible as evidence before the cour....forum.
Additional evidence available on request.

I guess you didn't actually read many of these VAERS reports.
Read 10 or 15 and tell me what you think. Of the random ones I picked none showed the vaccine as the cause of death. Most were very old with a whole host of conditions, many were covid positive already.

Give me some case numbers.

[Thumbs Up]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect -on the Canadians thread
I don't have a problem with someone making a choice for themselves, or giving their reason for their decision. I happen to believe that the scientific case for COVID vaccination is solid, and gets better as we see vaccination has been acceptably safe and effective. I have a problem with people who haven't sufficiently looked into the science, but feel "qualified" enough to repeat the above fringe anti-vaccine arguments as truth.

You know should look in the mirror about "people who haven't sufficiently looked into the science". You guys just like to talk about it, but you are not looking. Reuters fact check isn't going to show you what they are trying to obscure. What does "sufficiently looked into the science" mean to you? Reuters fact check? Boring over there in the echo chamber isn't it. No science posted. When are you going to post some science to prove me wrong about any of this? When is anybody? Listen to yourselves:

But this gets to the crux of the current anti-Covid-vax movement*; it's not based in public health science. It's driven by tribal allegiance, and by actors who thrive on sowing dissent in democratic countries.

Tribal allegiance? Not me. Communists? Terrorists? Not me. It's not based in public health science?? Over and over trying to get you guys to look at the science and you won't do it! Present the friggin science! Or point to the argument that says you are right. The discourse about the science with the top experts. No one is directly refuting the ones I have been quoting.

Looking forward to having this discourse although I have a feeling that you have no valid science to present. I see lots of articles about antivaxxers but none talk about the science. If you need to vent a little go ahead, maybe it can help you reach your quota for the week.

"In two weeks the sheeplike masses of any country can be worked up by the newspaper into such a state of excited fury that men are prepared to put on uniforms and kill and be killed, for the sake of the sordid ends of a few interested parties."-Albert Einstein

[Thumbs Up]

Originally Posted by bcboomer

I guess you didn't actually read many of these VAERS reports.
Read 10 or 15 and tell me what you think. Of the random ones I picked none showed the vaccine as the cause of death. Most were very old with a whole host of conditions, many were covid positive already.

Give me some case numbers.

I guess you didn't look then, the VAERS ID number is at the top of each one. Go ahead and read them. I have read many many many of them. "Of the random ones I picked none showed the vaccine as the cause of death" FDA/CDC hasn't admitted a single death happened from those vaccines, not a single one. Because they haven't done the required investigations! This constitutes fraud and malfeasance! "Most were very old with a whole host of conditions" Is that why they want to kill them off? Many were covid positive already Invariably, but most weren't and Covid is treatable.
And you Canadians are following our lead? Quoting our CDC? Our FDA? VAERS reports are official CDC/FDA reports not some fringe conspiracy group! And they are vastly underreported to. You guys are in a trance! This might be the zombie apocalypse. Increases in covid are unrelated to levels of vaccination. The writing is on the wall. These vaccines are ineffective and dangerous. There are better treatments.

[skipperpete]

Originally Posted by newhaul

That was technically correct. All new flu viruses are named after the place they first present.

Oh really!!........Ok , explain the “Spanish influenza”to us then.

[Thumbs Up]

From the 10/1/2021 release of VAERS data:
Found 347 cases where Age is 6-or-more-and-under-18 or 18-or-more-and-under-30 or 30-or-more-and-under-40 or 40-or-more-and-under-50 or 50-or-more-and-under-60 and Location is U.S., Territories, or Unknown and Onset Interval is 0 or 1 and Vaccine is COVID19 and Patient Died.
https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfi...ID19)&DIED=Yes

Almost each and every one of these looks like younger healthy people dying of the vaccine yet FDA/CDC isn't doing it's due diligence to declare a single one. You guys think these were made up or what? Now you want to give it to babies. It's murder.

This one died from the booster:

Write-up: Patient came in to receive his 3rd dose of Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine. He said he qualified as immunocompromised. The pharmacist on duty stated that he appeared to be in good health as far as she could tell. Team member claimed he was disoriented upon checking out for his purchase, they helped him to his car. He crumpled to the ground and team members helped him sit up in his car and waited with him for EMS. After a few minutes we were told that he became incoherent and this continued when EMS arrived. EMS medic came to the pharmacy around 12:30pm to let the pharmacist know the patient was despondent. Upon later information from the family, the patient had passed away at the hospital due to a brain bleed.

42 year old male:

Received the the 1st Pfizer COVID vaccine on 08/12/2021 and the 2nd Pfizer COVID vaccine on 09/02/2021. The Decedent''s wife had told Police that the Decedent was complaining about not feeling well ever since he got the 2nd vaccine. 09/12/2021 -- Decedent had an Asthma attack at 0400 hours. Per the Decedent''s wife, the Decedent did at least 10 Albuterol and Nebulizer treatments before calling for an ambulance at 1857 hours. While in the ambulance, the Decedent went unresponsive and then into Cardiac Arrest. EMS started CPR & ACLS procedures, and worked the Decedent for 1 hour before calling Time of Death at 2015 hours.

Look:

VAERS ID: 1732186 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age: 23.0
Sex: Male
Location: North Carolina

Vaccinated: 2021-09-01
Onset: 2021-09-01
Days after vaccination: 0
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2021-09-24
Vaccin*ation / Manu*facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (MODERNA)) / MODERNA 004C21A / 2 RA / IM
Administered by: Public Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Asthenia, Cardioversion, Death, Malaise, Myocardial infarction, Nausea, Respiratory arrest, Resuscitation, Vomiting
SMQs:, Anaphylactic reaction (broad), Acute pancreatitis (broad), Myocardial infarction (narrow), Embolic and thrombotic events, arterial (narrow), Acute central respiratory depression (narrow), Guillain-Barre syndrome (broad), Gastrointestinal nonspecific symptoms and therapeutic procedures (narrow), Hypersensitivity (broad), Respiratory failure (narrow)

Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2021-09-02
Days after onset: 1
Permanent Disability? No
Recovered? No
Office Visit? No
ER Visit? No
ER or Doctor Visit? No
Hospitalized? No
Previous Vaccinations:
Other Medications: xyzal
Current Illness: none
Preexisting Conditions: none
Allergies: none
Diagnostic Lab Data: Paramedics stated he died of heart attack.
CDC Split Type:

Write-up: Patient began complaining about not feeling well. He was nauseated and began throwing up and going to the bathroom. That continued off and on all night. Around 6:30 - 6am the next morning he said he was feeling somewhat better but was very weak. H e went back to bed. We checked on him around lunch time lying on his bed with his phone in his hand. He appeared to be trying to text. I checked on him a few minutes later and he had not moved. I checked and saw he wasn''t breathing. At that time he had a heart beat. We called 911 and I started CPR and continued for approx 25 until paramedics arrived. They bagged him and used defibrillator but could not bring him back.

That's the vaccine. 23. No pre-existing conditions! You guys till think these are made up?

Two more young boys:

VAERS ID: 1242573 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age: 15.0
Sex: Male
Location: Colorado

Vaccinated: 2021-04-18
Onset: 2021-04-19
Days after vaccination: 1
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2021-04-22
Vaccin*ation / Manu*facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH - / 1 RA / IM
Administered by: Public Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Cardiac failure, Death
SMQs:, Cardiac failure (narrow), Cardiomyopathy (broad)

Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 2021-04-20
Days after onset: 1
Permanent Disability? No
Recovered? No
Office Visit? Yes
ER Visit? No
ER or Doctor Visit? No
Hospitalized? No
Previous Vaccinations:
Other Medications: Vaccinated with Pfizer/Biontech, died 04/20/2021, 2 days after vaccination
Current Illness: No
Preexisting Conditions: No
Allergies: Nothing
Diagnostic Lab Data:
CDC Split Type:

Write-up: Heart failure

VAERS ID: 1406840 (history)
Form: Version 2.0
Age: 13.0
Sex: Male
Location: Unknown

Vaccinated: 2021-06-13
Onset: 2021-06-14
Days after vaccination: 1
Submitted: 0000-00-00
Entered: 2021-06-17
Vaccin*ation / Manu*facturer Lot / Dose Site / Route
COVID19: COVID19 (COVID19 (PFIZER-BIONTECH)) / PFIZER/BIONTECH EW0217 / UNK - / -
Administered by: Unknown Purchased by: ?
Symptoms: Death, Influenza like illness
SMQs:
Life Threatening? No
Birth Defect? No
Died? Yes
Date died: 0000-00-00
Permanent Disability? No
Recovered? No
Office Visit? No
ER Visit? No
ER or Doctor Visit? No
Hospitalized? No
Previous Vaccinations:
Other Medications:
Current Illness:
Preexisting Conditions:
Allergies:
Diagnostic Lab Data:
CDC Split Type:
Write-up: Flu like symptoms for 2 days then was found deceased

What would have been their chances of dying of covid, <.000000001?
Waiting to see the science from you guys. I call this malfeasance and murder by coercion.
male 28:

Write-up: Patient received the vaccine around 11 am. He hadn''t been feeling well (headache, dizziness) per report and initially called in to work. He then decided to come to work and was found down in a patient bathroom during his shift on our Facility while taking care of a patient (he was a nurse aid). Patient was coded and the team and was transferred to our Facility ED. He expired 3/3 2112

female 21:

Write-up: Patient contacted 911 complaining of not feeling well and difficulty breathing. Upon arrival patient was found by EMS in cardiac arrest. EMS was unable to get return of spontaneous circulation.

female 28:

As reported by the patient''s mother, the patient received the vaccine on 1/19/21, "got sick" on 1/20/21, and died in the early morning hours of 1/21/21. No further information was offered.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Perhaps you would like to do some digging Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus
Is a member of the communist party .
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-51720184
And hand picked by the CCP in Beijing.

Is being a Communist [from Ethiopia] better, or worse, than being a Republican or Democrat [from the USA]?

From the BBC article, you claim is evidence, that Tedros is a commie:
“... Dr Tedros became a member of the Tigray People's Liberation Front (TPLF) [1], which was in the vanguard of the 1991 overthrow of Ethiopia's Marxist dictator, Mengistu Haile Mariam ...”

Tedros served as Ethiopia’s health minister and foreign minister from 2005-2016 in a ruling coalition led by the Tigray People’s Liberation Front (TPLF) [1]. The TPLF effectively ruled Ethiopia for decades as the most powerful part of the coalition, until Prime Minister Ahmed Abiy took office in 2018.

[1] According to Wikipedia, the TPLF is “... a left-wing ethnic nationalist paramilitary group ...”
But, their history is very complex & changing, and not very well documented; so I won't presume to label them.


Excerpted from a ‘Guardian’ [April 10, 2020] article, by Stephen Buranyi:
➥ https://www.theguardian.com/news/202...andle-pandemic

“... Elected as WHO director general in July 2017, Tedros was supported by a bloc of African and Asian countries, including China, which has considerable influence with those members. (Tedros is himself from Ethiopia, where he served as health minister and then foreign minister between 2005 and 2016.) It was a “really nasty” election, said Davies, in which the powers that have traditionally shaped the WHO, such as the US, UK and Canada, lent their support to one of Tedros’s rivals, the British doctor David Nabarro. During the campaign, Tedros was criticised for having served in a repressive government with a poor human rights record, and one of Nabarro’s backers even accused Tedros of covering up a cholera epidemic during his time as health minister. (Tedros denied the claim, describing it as a “last-minute smear campaign”, while Nabarro told the New York Times that he had never authorised his team to make this accusation against Tedros.) In response, Tedros’s supporters mounted “a collective pushback”, said Davies, against the UK and its allies, eventually winning out. Tedros became the first director general from a so-called developing country since the Brazilian Dr Marcolino Gomes Candau in 1953 ...
... In Ethiopia, his political party, the Tigray People’s Liberation Front (TPLF) was mostly comprised of ex-revolutionaries, men that “seemed carved out of a rock”, said Fantu Cheru, a professor at American University and former advisor to the Ethiopian government. Tedros was different – jovial and accessible, said Cheru, and able to make personal connections easily. “He is not very ideological, he believes he can work with anyone,” said Mehari Taddele Maru, a professor at the European University Institute in Florence, Italy. Cheru also sees Tedros as a pragmatist. “He’s not in the Chinese pocket. The Americans in particular wanted to destroy his image. Tedros knows how this game works. You need to have more allies than enemies, and those allies may not have a good track record ...
... “I don’t think Tedros did anything previous director generals would not have done,” said Anthony Costello, the director of the UCL Institute for Global Health. “He needed a good relationship with China in order to get in.” Even Lawrence Gostin, who has been a prominent critic of Tedros in the past, told me that “his high praise for China is understandable. He is seeking to coax China into cooperation.” He went on to note, though, that this strategy “does risk the credibility of WHO as an objective agency ...”

From JAMEY KEATEN of The Associated Press [September 24, 2021]
➥ https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...a-second-term/
“Germany and France said they and other European Union countries have nominated Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus of Ethiopia for a second term as director-general of the World Health Organization. This marks the first time that a candidate for the top job at the U.N. health agency has not been nominated by the home country ...
... A diplomatic official in Geneva, speaking on condition of anonymity because she was not authorized to speak publicly about the matter, said 15 other European Union members joined in nominating Tedros ...”

Here’s a much less favourable (neutral) account, of Dr. Tedros’ history:
“Dr Cover-up: Tedros Adhanom’s controversial journey to the WHO” ~ by Avijit Goel [‘Health Express’, May 01, 2020]
➥ https://www.orfonline.org/expert-spe...the-who-65493/

[GordMay]

Thanks, to the Moderators, for re-opening this thread!
Now, back to science news:

Nanotech virus-hunters target SARS-CoV-2

Drug makers are looking to nanotechnology, for new ways to tackle viruses, including SARS-CoV-2.
Antiviral nanomaterials can encapsulate viruses in origami cages, mop them up with nanosponges, and target the lipid membrane surrounding enveloped virus particles.
Researchers’ aspirations go beyond the key part that nanomaterials have already played in the fight against SARS-CoV-2: the Pfizer–BioNtech and Moderna vaccines both rely on lipid nanoparticles, to carry messenger RNA into cells.

“Nanotechnology offers alternative ways to fight COVID-19 pandemic with antivirals” ~ by Mark Peplow
“A flurry of recent papers [ie: 1, 2] highlights growing interest in approaches that employ nanomaterials as antiviral countermeasures. Compared with traditional small molecules or antibodies that inhibit viral replication or cellular entry, nanotechnology offers drug developers virus binders, cell-membrane decoys or viral-envelope inhibitors that may complement conventional antiviral therapies. With the help of an influx of funding spurred by the COVID-19 pandemic, some researchers hope that these materials could soon move towards clinical translation ..."
➥ https://www.nature.com/articles/s41587-021-01085-1


[1] “Programmable icosahedral shell system for virus trapping” ~ by Christian Sigl et al
➥ https://www.nature.com/articles/s415...sJvtKCQMQ6M%3D

[2] “Stopping Membrane-Enveloped Viruses with Nanotechnology Strategies: Toward Antiviral Drug Development and Pandemic Preparedness” ~ by Bo Kyeong Yoon et al
➥ https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acsnano.0c07489

[jimbunyard]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Can you prove that?

Well, we'll take that question as rhetorical, as we all know TU's the new king of unreflective accusation and ignorant assumption.

See below.

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

Evidence is hereby presented for evaluation before the forum to prove that the following inferral, as suggested by Lake Effect is incorrect:
"vaccines with very low incidence of harm"

The plausibility of these of these reports has been evaluated (independently) to be greater than 80%.

What does this even mean? The reports are 'plausible', so I guess that means they're proof that 'covid vaccine bad'?

Now that's 'real science' for ya!


Many of the foreign listings are from Pfizer, Moderna, and J&J. They are required by law to post them onto VAERS. There is also a European reporting system as well as several other other countries (including Canada).

So? And?

The fact that, in the question you had stipulated "(in trials and now out in the general population)" is not only immaterial due to the real world up to date evidence from VAERS and other sources, but trials are being conducted by felons convicted (among other things) of fraudulently marketing pharmaceutical products.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/johns...investigations
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justi...nt-its-history
The trials written and designed by the vaccine manufacturers for their own products should be inadmissible due to flagrant conflicts of interest. And lack of proper control group. The trials were mostly conducted with younger healthy people and don't represent the group most at risk. Any raw data or leaked documents should be admissible as evidence before the cour....forum.

Finally we arrive at your real point, your tour de force.

Conspiracy theory.

In case you haven't realized, others in the world are aware of the crimes commited by big pharma. If anything, your misguided ire should be directed at capitalism or more accurately, the misapplication of the captialist model to corporate interests, which absolutely defines the corrupt future [and ultimate failure] of a capitalistic outlook in a finite space.

Additional evidence available on request.

Please... How 'bout providing some 'initial evidence'?

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

You know should look in the mirror about "people who haven't sufficiently looked into the science". You guys just like to talk about it, but you are not looking. Reuters fact check isn't going to show you what they are trying to obscure. What does "sufficiently looked into the science" mean to you? Reuters fact check? Boring over there in the echo chamber isn't it. No science posted. When are you going to post some science to prove me wrong about any of this? When is anybody?

Has it never occured to you that no one's bothered to "prove you wrong about any of this" (though many people have pointed out your logical fallacies [to no avail]) is because you haven't provided any scientific statements? As long as you continue to use second or third hand accounts as your primary source of (mis)information, you can expect to be greeted, correctly, with a certain level of opprobrium. To expect others to grant you full accreditation when you apparently fail to meet the requirements they hold for themselves, as regards intellectual rigor at least, is, for those conversant in human nature, mind-bogglingly naive.

Listen to yourselves:

Tribal allegiance? Not me. Communists? Terrorists? Not me. It's not based in public health science?? Over and over trying to get you guys to look at the science and you won't do it! Present the friggin science! Or point to the argument that says you are right. The discourse about the science with the top experts. No one is directly refuting the ones I have been quoting.

Looking forward to having this discourse although I have a feeling that you have no valid science to present. I see lots of articles about antivaxxers but none talk about the science. If you need to vent a little go ahead, maybe it can help you reach your quota for the week.

Yes. Please do. Or, once again, consider your actions before accusing others of the same, i.e. "look in the mirror". Just went back 3 pages, found zero instances of you providing primary scientific research links, as par, just wounded, paranoia-revealing rants and links to equally paranoiac websites.

"In two weeks the sheeplike masses of any country can be worked up by the newspaper into such a state of excited fury that men are prepared to put on uniforms and kill and be killed, for the sake of the sordid ends of a few interested parties."-Albert Einstein

Ah yes, the standard one-two punch of logical fallacy, an appeal to authority and an appeal to emotion (among others)

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

I guess you didn't look then, the VAERS ID number is at the top of each one. Go ahead and read them. I have read many many many of them. "Of the random ones I picked none showed the vaccine as the cause of death" FDA/CDC hasn't admitted a single death happened from those vaccines, not a single one. Because they haven't done the required investigations! This constitutes fraud and malfeasance! "Most were very old with a whole host of conditions" Is that why they want to kill them off? Many were covid positive already Invariably, but most weren't and Covid is treatable.

"Reading many of them" is not science. If you want to use VAERS data as a support for your failed assumption that covid vaccines are detrimental, anecdotal 'evidence' doesn't cut it.

Please provide any evidence that the "FDA/CDC hasn't admitted a single death happened from those vaccines, not a single one. Because they haven't done the required investigations!"


And you Canadians are following our lead? Quoting our CDC? Our FDA? VAERS reports are official CDC/FDA reports not some fringe conspiracy group! And they are vastly underreported to. You guys are in a trance! This might be the zombie apocalypse. Increases in covid are unrelated to levels of vaccination. The writing is on the wall. These vaccines are ineffective and dangerous. There are better treatments.

So, what's the cure for a "zombie apocalypse"? Something about cutting off their heads, in'nit?



Oh, and by the way, the one thing that would "make my skin crawl" would be the serial display of ignorance and misunderstanding exemplified below, had I not become inured to it by it's repetition.

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

These guys are talking about how to leverage the next pandemic to get the public to accept a universal messenger type RNA flu vaccine. This was December 29 2019! This video is making my skin crawl.
https://www.c-span.org/video/?465845...al-flu-vaccine

I watched this start to finish once, watched in pieces twice and listened to it twice. In no place did it talk about "how to leverage the next pandemic to get the public to accept a universal messenger type RNA flu vaccine". At about 10.5 minutes, the somewhat buffoonish moderator asked what would be necessary for a sense of urgency about the production of a universal flu vaccine to occur, in response to a statement about the lack of urgency existing in the current capitalistic mode of production, but at no time in the entire discussion did anyone suggest or imply "leverag[ing] the next pandemic to accept a mRNA vaccine". In fact, in the entire discussion mRNA was only brought up once; the discussion was about the prospects for a universal flu vaccine, regardless of the technology used to deliver it. Other techniques were also discussed, as well as the socio-politico-economical facets and challenges.

So once again, your personal opinion and conspiratorial mind-set cloud your judgement about a fairly informative and innocuous discussion among consumate professionals. (though about half of them seemed fairly loopy, i.e. an average representation of humanity...)

https://www.c-span.org/video/?465845...al-flu-vaccine

[jimbunyard]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Thanks, to the Moderators, for re-opening this thread!...

Was wondering about that... thought I remembered seeing it closed. Any idea what happened? Or is that off-limits?