Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Guy

You guy's think you were the only ones to grow up in the woods? I grew up shooting wildlife or all sorts. My favorite was shooting frogs with a 22, right between the eyes.
If I am out having a nature moment these days, the shift to killing something is just too big . The dentist who shot the lion, was he enjoying nature?

In my house, we were not permitted to kill anything unless it was for food. We had respect for animals and treated them well.

This is a circuitous difference in attitudes leading to an argument.

1/.If you eat meat and fish, someone has to kill it.

2/. If you dont, then dont go hunting or fishing.

Your preferences apply to you only.

On a personal note, I have no interest in game hunting for trophies. As long as authorities permit it for big $$$$ it will continue.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

Probably my most unique was while I was sitting quietly along the edge of a partially overgrown woods road, sitting with my back against a big tree next to a very small spruce tree, when suddenly a fox coming from behind me squeezed between the two trees, which put him almost in my lap. The two of us, literally eye to eye with only inches between us, just paused for a second trying to absorb the reality of the presence of the other, and then it was almost as if the fox just shrugged and continued on his way off to my right and out of sight. Nothing quite like that has ever happened to me when i wasn't hunting. ... it's all the other things that happen and things I see and experiences I have as part of the process that keeps me coming back.

Nicely said jtsailjt, and I agree. It's what I said earlier; the actual killing of an animal is not what most hunters relish about the activity. It is, as you say, "all the other things that happen and things I see and experiences I have as part of the process." This is why I say that for most people the activity of hunting is simply an excuse to get out into the semi-wilds. For some reason people (again ... mostly men) seem to need to have this excuse.

For me, I long ago realized being part of wilderness is enough. I can relay dozens of similar experiences that have happened to me while canoe tripping or sea kayaking (and now sailing). You don't need a rod or a gun; you just need to get out there, and be present in the moment.

There are those who hunt for trophies or for "sport," like the one Guy cites. This is a rare attitude in the local hunters (and fishers) I've known over the years, although it is certainly present and is part of the industry of hunting. Most hunters talk like you jtsailjt, which is why I say that if you are just looking for an excuse to get into the wilderness, then take a camera. Unless, of course, you want or need to hunt (including fishing) for food. If so, then it only makes sense to do so in the most efficient, and hopefully humane way possible.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by weavis

When I first went to Florida, RV park was $10-$15 a night. (2002) Now......... $50-$80 a night.

This sums up my exact concern with anchoring restrictions, and mooring fields as I believe it will go the same way.



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[Prairie Chicken]

Originally Posted by StuM

A bullet is a much cleaner and kinder end than being brought down and devoured by carnivores or a slow lingering death from starvation or disease when it is too old/weak to survive.

Assuming it is cleanly done, a bullet is also considerably more humane than the factory farming of animals being employed today.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by weavis

When I first went to Florida, RV park was $10-$15 a night. (2002) Now......... $50-$80 a night.

That's insane! Guess I'm not going to Florida on this trip .

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

That's insane! Guess I'm not going to Florida on this trip .

Its for RVs Mike, not tents.....
I have no idea on costs for that.

[weavis]

Talking to my buddies Kenomac and BOatie, they both anchor out 99% of the time.
Boatie gave me a brief list of places to do it, and spent a number of years doing it that way he suggested.
Kenomac does it nearly everywhere he goes. It saves the proverbial fortune in fees.

Need good anchors and a decent runabout dinghy.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

This sums up my exact concern with anchoring restrictions, and mooring fields as I believe it will go the same way.



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Of course it will A64.
Boaters will be squeezed and bled dry until it truly become the playground for the rich only.

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by weavis

Talking to my buddies Kenomac and BOatie, they both anchor out 99% of the time.
Boatie gave me a brief list of places to do it, and spent a number of years doing it that way he suggested.
Kenomac does it nearly everywhere he goes. It saves the proverbial fortune in fees.

Need good anchors and a decent runabout dinghy.

Even if you don't consider the safety aspects, investing in good anchoring gear is a great bargain just in the marina fee$ it helps you avoid. In Maine, marina's that have slips for rent are pretty rare and they typically charge $2-$3 a foot/night so if your boating budget looks anything like mine, you don't have much choice other than to rent a mooring or to anchor out. Locally the going price for a mooring rental seems to be about $30/night, so it doesn't take too long to pay for that anchor and gear with the added advantage of knowing exactly what's down there holding you when the wind starts to pipe up, something I always wonder about when on a rental mooring.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by weavis

Its for RVs Mike, not tents.....
I have no idea on costs for that.

We've been finding that dedicated tenting spaces are become less and less common in organized parks. Provincial, state, national and certainly private campgrounds cater to the RV crowd. When there are tent-only sites that are often stuck in the undesirable areas. This is all a big change for me compared to the last time I was car camping. Of course that was close to forty years ago, so I shouldn't be surprised.

Originally Posted by weavis

Talking to my buddies Kenomac and BOatie, they both anchor out 99% of the time. ... Need good anchors and a decent runabout dinghy.

Absolutely! We anchor out virtually all the time. I don't like being at a dock. Aside from being costly, and linked to urban seductions where more money will get sucked away, I just don't like marinas. The crowds, the noise, the smells, the way the boat feels laying against the dock, all keep me away.

Never skimp on anchoring gear. And even more importantly, learn how to anchor well. The investment in equipment and skill will pay off many-fold.

[a64pilot]

I used to RV some in a 36' fifth wheel, way back in a VW Westfalia, and further back in a tent.
The few tent spaces there are outside of State Parks are usually put where an RV won't fit, sort of an afterthought.
RV's seem to desire "pull thru" spots above trees, and they seem to be not much more than big parking lots with a Campground store that's overpriced. I pretty quickly lost interest in RV'ing, and do not want cruising to go that way, but if it does, I guess I'll have to leave the US, cause I'm not "cruising" from one Marina to the other, even if I could afford it, which I can't.

RV'ing seemed to become more about the RV, who had the most room, most luxury and not being in nature


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[Ribbit]

I used to love motorcycle touring round Spain and Portugal in the Autumn and Winter. My last trip there was in 2008. I worked in Spain and Portugal for a while, absolutely love the places and the people, and totally despise those that have hurt them so badly and inexcusably.

A tent pitch on a camp site had gone up to 30 to 34 euros a night. I hope to go back some time when the deranged bonkers is over.

If you live by tourism, don't kill the golden geese.

If you live by boaters, don't kill the golden geese.

The same approach is pretty much killing motorcycling (retailers expect people to pay as much as £1,000 for a set of leathers, £800 for a crash helmet, and £300 for a pair of boots, and the price of motorbikes . . . ), and turned it into a fashion statement. I stopped buying Ducatis in the 1970's (my last one was a Darmah), when the importer, after Italy DEVALUED the lira massively, put the prices up massively instead of reducing them. Ok on my own it didn't make any difference, other than to me, but being alone won't always be the case. Reality always ends up winning in the end.

Same was done to shooting over here. Priced the grass roots out of the sport, then people that should know better, walked all over the guntrade, and people's Rights.

The only way to win, is don't play.

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

SNIP

When there are tent-only sites that are often stuck in the undesirable areas.

SNIP

Not sure what you consider an undesirable area but I do some camping both from a car and a kayak and have never had a problem finding desirable areas. Of course many of these places are well off the beaten path.

Both when sleeping in my RV, camping in a tent, or cruising on my boat I tend to look for places that are well away from cities, stores, bars, and people in general.

This issue keeps going back to the fact that as more people demand more anything the price goes up.

Learn it, know it, live it.

[mausgras]

Originally Posted by weavis

When I first went to Florida, RV park was $10-$15 a night. (2002) Now......... $50-$80 a night.

I've just completed a road trip around western NSW and was shocked at the cost of built accommodation. Motels were around 15O AUD, country pubs not much less than 100 and even on site vans in tourist parks 60 to 80 dollars. But camping out in National Parks was an absolute delight. Camping areas were tidy, discrete, and usually with a clean and functional toilet amenity nearby. You usually have to provide your own water and lighting fires is discouraged but rarely banned except during the fire season. The cost is usually around 10 dollars left in an honesty box.
Then if you really wanted to avoid paid accommodation you can always pull into a rest area, boil a billy and sleep in your car or van and move on in the morning after another billy.

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[carstenb]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

In Maine, marina's that have slips for rent are pretty rare and they typically charge $2-$3 a foot/night so if your boating budget looks anything like mine, you don't have much choice other than to rent a mooring or to anchor out. Locally the going price for a mooring rental seems to be about $30/night, so it doesn't take too long to pay for that anchor and gear with the added advantage of knowing exactly what's down there holding you when the wind starts to pipe up, something I always wonder about when on a rental mooring.

These prices are shockers for me. Here in Denmark a marina (including water and electricity) usually costs something like $30-40 per night. Oer boat is 40 feet.

The other countries around the Baltic are about the same.