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haaho · 07-01-2012, 03:06

Hi every one.
If you were to build a boat which one would you choose:

Didi 34 radius chine plywood sailboat or

PELICANpage ?

We (wife, 4 years old boy and me) have NO boatin/sailing/even fishing experience at all. But we might be able to finance building a boat in the near or not so near future

We wll try to try bouth for shure, to see which one we will like. Now just talking about the designs

I choose these models because they have:

-equal cost
-equal payload
-equal speed

Happy New Year to everyone

P.S. We want to travel everywere

**GordMay** · 07-01-2012, 06:27

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, haaho.

gpdno · 07-01-2012, 06:36

As a sailor who has built a few boats before, my advice would be to start small

Unless your a carpenter by trade, building a boat could be a challenge and certainty a learning experience. I think you would be better off starting out with a small pram or such around 8-10' just to gain some experience in building and for that matter sailing

That way you can learn to build and sail a boat in a few weeks rather than waiting several years to build some 30+ foot boat.

I would suggest something out of Dynamite Payson's instant boat book. I build the "cartopper" for my kids and it's a quite a fun little boat. It took about 3 weekend to finish. The build was complicated enough to offer a challenge but not enough to be overwhelming.
InstantBoats.com

If you want something a little bigger but still simple enough for a first time builder/sailor you might check out Stevenson's Weekender. Again, easy enough to build and learn to sail on.
Stevenson Projects

Either way enjoy

SunDevil · 07-01-2012, 06:55

The Pelican is the one I would build.

You can spend $20,000 and $10,000 worth of upgrades and get a much better monohull sailboat in working condition. Try pricing all of the stuff that you would need to buy in a monoull sailboat built from scratch and it gets really expensive compared to the cost of used boats. It is better to work for an extra year and save every penny if you go that route. Boat loans are also possible.

Multihulls are a different story. Big enough mutlihulls for a family start at $60,000 and get more expensive. I think you could build one for less using the wood/epoxy method.

Pelicanp2

It looks like a good boat to me. I would want bigger windows in the salon is the only thing.

And start by building a dingy first at least to see how you do. How long does it take, how organized are you, how much does it cost, and can you build it right? Practice and learn for other woodworkers too. There are probably a few retirees that like woodworking and would love to teach you and then would be able to help cut boards or do finishing touches on the boat.

Where is everywhere that you would be sailing to?

**boatman61** · 07-01-2012, 07:12

Welcome to CF Haaho...

I'd build neither...
The mono... for me is not suitable for the extended travel that you appear to want..
And the cat has no appeal..

My options working on your parameters would be...
James Wharram Catamarans - Photo albums.

and for the mono a Kylix... but then I'm an old fart...

**skipmac** · 07-01-2012, 07:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDevil

Try pricing all of the stuff that you would need to buy in a monoull sailboat built from scratch and it gets really expensive compared to the cost of used boats. It is better to work for an extra year and save every penny if you go that route. Boat loans are also possible.

100% agree, I starting adding up the costs for all the parts and equipment: mast, rigging, engine, lines, anchors, rodes, winches, wiring, lights, etc, etc, etc and it was much cheaper to buy a used boat to fix up than to build one.

However, IF you are really, really good at scrounging and live in an area where there are lots of old boats, marinas and boat yards that would give you places to look for old, used equipment AND you have way more time than money (or potential to work more and make more money) then you MIGHT be able to build a very minimalist boat more cheaply than buying a used one.

gpdno · 07-01-2012, 09:20

Yes, that's why I suggest a small boat for the first build. Its inexpensive, It will teach you how to build a boat, how a boat works, and how to sail. Later you can use it a your tender for the bigger cruising sailboat

**boatman61** · 07-01-2012, 09:27

(Hypotheticaly)..... Hey guys....

haaho · 07-01-2012, 09:49

Thanks for your replyes.

We WILL build a small boat first, just to learn, but want to know what we are learning for. And we know that second hand boat will probably be cheaper.

Boatman61, why do tou say mono is not suitable for extended cruise - 600 ltrs. of water and 150 ltrs. of fuel ???

Both boat's design look like desig masterpiece for me, light, strong and fast.
I have looked all Warrams's designs, I much preffer Pelican, all the warrams are two or three times havyer

We intend to go "everywere", from norwegian fiords to Mexico, starting from Black Sea.

P.S. That Kylix up there is super, but it is not our type of design

**Boracay** · 07-01-2012, 11:04

For all the work that goes into a building one's own boat, and as you're planning some extended cruising I'd suggest going a little larger.

What about the Easy 11.6?

haaho · 07-01-2012, 11:36

Yes, I have looked at them too. But Boracay, why bigger, we are three?

Easy 11.6 is 4400 kg. (light or CWL?) Pelican 2200 kg. and they are not so diferent in useful area.

What I like in Pelican is actualy smaller living area??? compare to others 11 m cats

but much better aerodynamic shape. I like the designer idea of a sail boat instead of (motor)sailing caravan

I might be all wrong, though, zero experience here.

For now it is between these two boats, Didi 34 and Pelican?
Both have +/-, and I would like to see what experienced sailors have to say.

**s/v Jedi** · 07-01-2012, 12:00

To build these 30'ish foot boats to sail them everywhere the world round is the purest form of SM if you ask me

A cat that size can hardly carry the food, fuel and water you need for a Pacific crossing.

Two books that you *must* read before taking the next step:

- Cruising Encyclopedia by Steve & Linda Dashew
- Wooden Boat Construction by the Gaucheon Brothers (West System Epoxy)

that 2nd book even when you intend to build from fiberglass or metal.

Now something to think about: the cost of the hull is 25-33% of total boat cost. Interior is 33%. systems and rigging the rest. When you build light and use efficient rig, you can build longer boats for almost the same cost. While the hull is longer, the interior living space is the same, the rest is just bare for storage, engine room etc. Use watertight bulkheads to separate these areas. This is one of the principles behind the Dashew designs. The extra length provides more comfort and a huge step in safety.

Wood-epoxy-glass makes the stiffest hulls while being very light, only beat by racers.

cheers,
Nick.

Lagoon4us · 07-01-2012, 12:03

Hi and welcome, i've built many boats in my working life, Build a small sailing dinghy that you can introduce yourself and family to the build process and the eventual sailing rewards.
Also try to crew on a sailboat, go to your local yacht club, join and offer yourself for crewing on saturday afternoons.
If there's a local boatyard then seek out someone doing a major reno or build in sinilar materials and help them.

What i'm saying is go learn most of it is free, then you will have a much clearer view on what is best for you. Good luck.

Lagoon4us · 07-01-2012, 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

To build these 30'ish foot boats to sail them everywhere the world round is the purest form of SM if you ask me

A cat that size can hardly carry the food, fuel and water you need for a Pacific crossing.

Two books that you *must* read before taking the next step:

- Cruising Encyclopedia by Steve & Linda Dashew
- Wooden Boat Construction by the Gaucheon Brothers (West System Epoxy)

that 2nd book even when you intend to build from fiberglass or metal.

Now something to think about: the cost of the hull is 25-33% of total boat cost. Interior is 33%. systems and rigging the rest. When you build light and use efficient rig, you can build longer boats for almost the same cost. While the hull is longer, the interior living space is the same, the rest is just bare for storage, engine room etc. Use watertight bulkheads to separate these areas. This is one of the principles behind the Dashew designs. The extra length provides more comfort and a huge step in safety.

Wood-epoxy-glass makes the stiffest hulls while being very light, only beat by racers.

cheers,
Nick.

GOOD ADVICE......