MacGregor Owner of the Future

[cdennyb]

I had planned on a more laid-back situation. The plan was two couples. That would mean plenty of room and privacy for 4 people if they wanted it. As far as acess goes, the swim steps at the back are really useable, not just pretty to look at. I know Cats are real popular but I didn't really think or plan for a "cattle boat" type arrangement. More like, invite some friends I haven't met yet and take their money to help pay for a cruising lifestyle island hopping.
Is that what most of you were thinking when voicing your opinions on size, comfort, etc.?
db

[TaoJones]

It seems to me that what you most want is to get out of the rat race and enjoy a more sedate, fun-filled lifestyle. It also seems that you have your heart set on the Mac65 you found down in the Caribe, and that you then began to think of a way to have the boat, the lifestyle and a way to get others to pay for it.

In my experience, you may be able to have two of the three, perhaps, but you can't have all three.

If you want that boat and the mellow lifestyle, forget the charter dive business. If you want a charter dive business and a mellow lifestyle, forget that boat. If you want that boat and a charter dive business, forget the mellow lifestyle!

If I wanted a charter dive operation, I'd shop around for one that some other sucker, sorry, entrepreneur had beat himself up trying to make work, and offer him a pittance to take it off his hands. Even then, chances are slim that it will evolve into a laid back, blissful "retirement," with mai-tais on the afterdeck at sundown and steaks on the grill, all paid for by your guests.

Nothing, I maintain, ruins a wonderful hobby like turning it into a money-making (or, more likely, money-losing) business. Why sacrifice the joy you may find in sailing and/or diving for pleasure, by making it your "business," especially when it's escaping from the business life that's motivating your fantasy?

TaoJones

[Ex-Calif]

"Is that what most of you were thinking when voicing your opinions on size, comfort, etc.?"

I was under the impression you wanted to make money or break even with a boat in a charter business. With fuel to get to the sites and the expense of the boat and dive equipment being fixed costs, in order to "break even" you have to cover those costs. Provisioning, cancellations etc are variable costs. I am sure I am not saying anything you haven't considered.

To do that it seems most every dive charter I have been on runs boats of at least 10 with a few smaller boats going with groups of 6. i.e. without enough paying people the charter doesn't go.

Now if you are not interested in making money and just want to defray part of the cost of the boat your idea seems workable. Especially if you have a lot of friends who like diving.

What the vacationer is looking for is "reliability" so if I enquire about your boat and you run charters only when you feel like it, people who recommend such things may not put you and your boat on their radar.

I hope you don't take any of this the wrong way. I am just thinking out loud to fuel the discussion.

So - If you can afford the boat, want the boat and can afford the lifestyle. Go for it. If you offer up charters a few times a year to offset some of your own costs great but I wouldn't build my plan around that income.

Personally, I would be very interested in a 2 week "share expenses and duties" charter on a 50+ foot ketch once a year. I would not be too interested in passage making but joining the boat in one of the south pacific or asian island chains, doing some scuba, sailling and exploring would be awesome. I wouldn't spend $5,000 to do it but I could see $200 a day being possible - about the same as a resort hotel. I don't think a person with a 50+ foot boat would think that a good deal for them, however.

OTOH - Me, my SO and perhaps my son at $200 per day for 14 days = $8,400 + air and land transfer to meet the boat. I'd probably end up deciding to put that money in "my" boat kitty.

[Divecoz]

Well cdennyb is the Mac 65 ideal for your plan? We havnt read enough yet. Can you set up businesses running out of those ports ? IMHO . . .No! I say that have done a bit of business in Mexico over the years. First off YOU cannot Captain the boat! Lots of laws you need to consider. Could you in time? Maybe and its all about making friends learning the ropes and . . .the laws! Ball Park figurefor proper papers IF they are even available when you apply. $10,000.00 USD per country.
IMHO is the Mac 65 setup for hauling say 6 divers and tanks? Not IMHO.
L.A. countries are not like here in the USA. You dont just show up and hang out a sign. Well you could if you like the idea of living in jail while they strip your boat.

[Divecoz]

Name your boat I SCUBA or something that would quietly get the word out
in every port. You'll get a few interested folks. Try when and if you can to moor close to the city center / tourist area. Get on a lot of chat boards and post the availability of you and your boat with pictures. Mingle at night at all the Diver bar's , every town has them. You might well want to get certified as a dive instructor. Net Work everywhere you can. It will offset your cost and if you work hard and provide a good service you might even be successful. Take some gourmet cooking classes as well.
You want every person and every couple who does come aboard to have their Socks Knocked Off. I see the possibility of two groups to be attracted. Hard core Macho Dives and Couples / honeymooners and middle-age empty nesters.

[TaoJones]

While your comments are worthwhile in a generic sense, divecoz, I don't think the originator of this thread is still active here. All five of his posts are contained in this thread, and were over a couple of days about seven months ago. He last logged in here over four months ago.

In checking YachtWorld, I see that the boat he seemed to have his heart set on at the time is still on the market in Curacao: MacGregor Pilothouse Cutter Rigged Sloop 1994 Boat For Sale My guess is that he either abandoned the idea, or concluded that that is the wrong vessel to base his concept on. It would be interesting to get an update from cdennyb.

I think the advice you offered is all valid, divecoz, and it's possible that further research into all the ramifications of what he proposed gave cdennyb a much clearer picture of how complicated it actually was. Still, if he carries the dream in his heart, I hope he finds a way to make it happen.

TaoJones

[Divecoz]

I had hoped he might check in from time to time??
Yes his thoughts / dreams are a Major crap shoot and if it was easy a million others would be doing just that.
Working Papers are PITA in L.A. requiring lots of money and often lots of time. Occasionally only to find that after spending $$ and time, Your Not getting yours! Not to do what you want to do. NOW btw you on the radar screen Big Time!
Its a great dream though. I have had One friend caught without proper papers and deported another jailed fined and, then released. He was even allowed to stay and try . . . to do it right.
Its a great Dream though....
IMHO The Mac 65 though its fast as all get out, its just not the best for the purpose of dive charters. But who really knows? With enough talent in enough areas you might be able to do some Mod's and make it a real Jewel.

[cdennyb]

Yes, I'm still active although I am also active other places as well. I have read with interest your comments (all of you) and find you've made some very interesting points of view.
I certainly uderstand the limited space and useability of the Mac 65 and have looked at other vessels as well. I've thought of the Beneteau 510, and other B models as well with the swim step at the rear. This is a must and if I were to buy a Cat italso would be of that design. OK, on with my comments to everyones suggestions.

The thought of cruising is the primary interest here and I've (since the original post date months ago) contacted several Universities and their scientists working on their degree programs. In afew instances they have presented an interestin using this boat of mine as a scientif platform to further their research on the reef, the oceans in general, and the bulk of their studies that require something other than a BIG STEEL hull to interfer with their results.

I have changed my direction slightly from the charter business light to a more scientific direction where 'interns', researchers, etc. can buy their way onto a project boat and I can enjoy the cruising lifestyle as well.

Since I have no preconceived direction, location, etc. that I want to visit, everywhere in time will be fine, I'm open to their itinerary initially. Of course all of this is subject to change as the events unfold and at this time I'm still kicking it around and welcomeyour comments.

Even though you may not get a comment from me the day you post it, I probably read it. Keep submitting your views and I will listen.

Thanks everyone, you're a world of welcome info.

Dennis

[rtbates]

That Westsail 32 that you bad mouthed is at the very least 100 times the ocean boat compared to the Mac 65...

Good luck with your plans..

[Divecoz]

Randy 100 X's better ha!ha!ha!ha!ha! Mac 65's have been all over the world and were for years ( almost 20 of them)the fastest Mono hulls in the world....
SOoooooo Hands up and back away from the key board lad !
and did I miss where he talked about Trans Atlantic Voyages????
Few would argue and then only with none of their money on top of t the Bar that the Mac 65 wouldn't or couldn't out run just about any and every sailboat in island hopping.

[CharlieCobra]

I know a few M65 owners. Great boats, a bit spartan (plastic fantastics) inside for my taste but very, very fast. Do they flex a bit in heavy seas? Yes, they do, at least the original Race versions did. I think the PH versions are stiffer and I know they're heavier. I came real close to buying "Joss" last year with the intention of racing her but it didn't happen.

[Divecoz]

Roger and his favorite West Coast Dealer still on occasion race Rogers PH 65.