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11-04-2006, 20:33

Thank you for clarifying that K.

CaptainK · 11-04-2006, 20:34

Not a problem Kai. I hate to see people looking confused?

Dread Pirate Roberts · 11-04-2006, 22:39

OK guys,
I think I have found a boat that I like. I'm looking at the hunter 460. It looks like it would handle alright (not to wide). I can't seem to find a profile diagram of one so don't know what the draft is. It's bigger than most people recomend. Some one set me straight before I waste $300,000 on a boat I can't handle.

12-04-2006, 00:08

Allot of ways to look at this, but my perspective is, (unless $300k is a drop in the bucket for you), spend $100k on a better quality used boat, and the other $200k cruising.

CaptainK · 12-04-2006, 00:46

I agree with Kai.

If you search "yachtworld" or other yacht seller websites. You can find a boat in that footage range. And spend even less than $100,000 on a used and proven boat. What you were looking to spend, like Kai said. Is use the other $200,000 , on your cruising budget.

Depending on your lifestyle. Your lifestlye budget per month could be a modest $1,000 per month or less. Or you could spend even more, over a $1,000 per month partying your tail off. And stoping and tying up at every marina on your route?

But, you could just save buying a "used" sailboat. Just look around on the internet. You'll find a deal on a used Hunter 460!!

Dread Pirate Roberts · 13-04-2006, 10:48

Here's an insteresting idea,
I'm wondering how much weight I can put in the davits without getting too rediculous. I see that almost every one has either an inflatable or a light weight dingy. Is this because of weight limitations or size limitations. I know I would need a better hoist but that's just a matter of money. Would I be comletely out of my mind to through say 1400 lbs on the back?
Thanks for not laughing at me,
Dread Pirate Roberts

Dread Pirate Roberts · 13-04-2006, 10:49

Oh and in addition to that, how reasonable is it to add wieght with hoists at the mid section?

Tropic Cat · 21-04-2006, 06:15

I think you ought to consider a full boat as opposed to a 1/2 boat (smile)

**Pblais** · 21-04-2006, 06:29

Davits have a weight limit. Mine are 300 lbs. The serious issue is a breaking wave in following seas crashing on top of the dinghy. That much force won't be held and the davits will be ripped loose casting the dinghy adrift and leaving small to major holes where the davits attach. Losing a dinghy is sad. Holes in the boat are very bad - always.

When my dad was in the Navy they had a great crane mid ship. It was useful if someone parked a jeep too close to the ship. They had contests to see who could stash it in a hold fastest. When in port it always comes in handy to have an extra jeep.

CaptainK · 21-04-2006, 08:38

On the Nimitz class aircraft carriers. On the starboard aft end. They have a aircraft crane. Strong enough to lift up F-14 tomcat fighter jets off the dock.

They even use the crane to lower or raise the 50 foot motor whale boats into the water. Whenever the ship makes a overseas port call!!

Pura Vida · 21-04-2006, 11:39

DPR, In the early 1990s my live aboard friends used to laugh at my Snark. But I sailed it every day while they sat on the hook. Ultimately on the water time will teach you more than anything else. Also Quarter Moon is right, find a place to crew. If you are inland buy a small boat and use it as much as possible for a year or two.

Ones first boat is almost always a trainer. When I bought my first keel boat I spent a lot of time on bigger (35'+) boats that the owners didn't want to take out by themselves. A lot of sailing on other peoples boats will show you which ones you will like and which ones you will not. There is always someone in the marina that is looking for crew for a daysail.

Finally consider the suggestion that $400k is what you should invest in a company that builds boats, not in the boat itself. A world class passagemaker can be had for under $100k. Sure a lot of money can be spent but when you read Hill, Hiscock, Dumas, Guzzwell and the likes it becomes clear that money is not what drives a boat.

S/V Elusive · 29-04-2006, 06:53

DP - When you go sailing with Kai, you WILL learn all about buckets (I just love triple puns). Anyway - size of boat is SO subjective that I doubt that anyone here can tell you much that would help. Only YOU know how you feel about certain things - and everyone is different.

I do have a couple of suggestions for you - There are several places that offer a series of ASA certified classes, AND - allow you to join a 'club' that has various boats that you can rent once you've completed those courses and have been checked out on a particular boat. I did this in San Francisco about 7 years ago - GREAT way to experience several different types of boats and develope opinions about different rigs and accommodations.

ALSO - join your local yacht club. Heck, even Kai belongs to one (same one I do). On my web site there is a section on how I went about finding the right boat for me, and also on yacht clubs - they may help you.

Good luck!

hellosailor · 30-04-2006, 20:48

DPR, I'd STRONGLY suugest that you want to spend some time on a variety of boats in the range you are considering. And if that means a half dozen charters for a weekend or week each, just DO IT.

You cannot get a feel for how well a boat will handle from reading about it. To say that the Hunter 460 "looks like" it would handle well, just shows that you are at a major risk of having a bad sailing experience and possible financial loss. Not that Hunter is a bad boat, and not that I would know a 460 if I tripped over one. But Hunter also has a rep for being a "beginners boat" and "built to a price" so yes, I would want to sail on one before guessing anything based on reading.
The difference between a really sweet yacht and a pig may (may!) be visible on paper if you have really good skills with the numbers. But I don't think anyone can tell you if a boat will be "mediocre" versus "sweet" until they sail on it. A really sweet boat can self-steer simply by balancing the sails. In theory, any properly designed yacht can. In practice? Un-uh. And then having a comfortable motion, not pounding in waves or slamming or rolling, all of these things cross well into the black arts, there is no yacht design software in the world that can assure these things. And no paper that can tell you how to predict them.
Boats have different personalities (probably why we name them and call them she<G>) and there are Jeeps, Ferraris, SUVs, and everything in between. In big boats, those differences become bigger too. A sloop will have a simple sail plan, but a more complex rig will have more options for keeping the boat trimmed, and that can be a good thing.
Hydraulics, electronics, all the good toys? They're nice, but unless you can afford a megayacht with redundant systems and a mechanical staff on standby, they're not what sailing is about. They tend to break down at the most inconvenient times, even if you are intimate with them, and then you're back to sailing again. With your muscles against the boat's muscles, and the boat is always bigger and stronger than you are, so you'd better know how to outsmart or cajole it.
Think a center cockpit design looks good on paper? OK, now try sailing it upwind in bad wx for a weekend and getting soaked because you're in the middle of the boat instead of aft.
Think a nice wide salon is good? It is great to be airy and roomy--until you get thrown across it in bad wx, and find out that the narrower a boat is, the closer a handgrip will be. Or at least, you can't be thrown as far. I know a well-respected 42' boat where we found out the towel bar in the forward head makes a lousy handgrip--as you are being ejected out the head door. Fortunately the opposite wall is less than two feet away.<G>
You just won't be able to anticipate all the differences like that on paper. You need to go out and DO IT to get the feel for how they differ.