Progressing towards being a live aboard

[thursday]

Hello, I'm a long-time lurker that is getting closer to trading in their land legs for sea legs.

Like many, the pandemic gave me a lot of time to watch YouTube and in doing that I came across the plethora of sailing youtube channels. I'd always liked boats, but never owned one, and loved the sea. I live on a small island in Northern Europe, and part of the draw was the water. I'd thought that it'd be cool to live on a boat for a long time but never made it past "that's a cool idea" and watching the youtubes made me realize how possible it is.

With that, I put into motion a plan to transition to living in a boat over the course of a few years. I have taken sailing classes, got some certificates, rented a 26' boat and sailed around the Swedish archipelago. Now I'm working on figuring out my financials: should I sell my place or rent it? How much boat do I want? How much boat can I get? I am a remote worker and also working on making a company to develop a source of in passive income.

Currently I'm thinking I'll sell my place, which should give me, pre-tax, over 100k euros to work with which I think is more than enough. While I don't have a any specific boat in mind, my current goal is to maximize size (length and beam) but also be manageable single-handed. I'd like a big enough boat that friend and family could join me without discomfort. But we'll see, some of the journey is also learning to give up certain comforts that are easier on land (such as space). My current idea is to work up some skill sailing around the Med, and around Europe, with the goal of coming out, maybe going across the Atlantic or down along the African coast.

This forum has been a fantastic resource, and thank you everyone who tirelessly answer questions, offer advice, and share their experiences.

[Celestialsailor]

Welcome to the forum. If it were me, I'd hang onto your dwelling and rent it out and see if cruising is a fit for you. Good luck.

[tkeithlu]

Ditto on Celestial's answer.

Boats go up in cost to own and interior space by a power of 3. A 15 meter boat is huge beside a 10 meter. Start at about 10 meters length, and consider whether the space you find will do what you want. Stop when you find the minimum. Then consider other factors.

Don't get sucked into buying a project boat. Think properly maintained and ready to sail. A project will cost more, and take all your sailing time away from you.

Come back with more specific questions. Good luck with it.

[thursday]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Welcome to the forum. If it were me, I'd hang onto your dwelling and rent it out and see if cruising is a fit for you. Good luck.

Thank you for the response. I'm of two minds about it: certainly maintaining it makes it easier to go back to land if it turns out I don't enjoy the life but on the other hand, the money I would have by selling my place would allow me to buy a nicer boat and it would be one less liability.

I'm learning closer to selling it. I am lucky in that I have a safety net of friends I can fall back on if things don't work out and even if I lost all of my house money in a boat, within a few years I would be in a position to put a down payment on a home. So that makes me more inclined to just go all the way.

What do you think? Do you suggest holding onto my abode just in case I don't like the life? Or are you more thinking as a source of income via the rent?

Thank you!

[JPA Cate]

Both, actually: the income stream and the safe place if the lifestyle doesn't fit. It is very difficult to imagine accurately how much inflation can occur in the housing market over the period of a lifetime cruising. ...And even small boats are expensive toys. If you can set it up so that the property is well managed, at the end of the cruise, when you've been gone for 30 yrs, and all your friends have moved location, your place could perhaps be waiting for you. It would be a luxury.

I have to say that i agree with tkeithlu, see the smallest boat that will do the job for you, and go with it. Start thinking "cosy" and "secure in a seaway" as a value more important than "space".

Ann

[goboatingnow]

Sure sell an appreciating asset and exchange it for a wasting one !

[thursday]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Sure sell an appreciating asset and exchange it for a wasting one !

While a house is generally an appreciating asset, it is not the only one and it does come with some liabilities, including the debt, having to repair appliances, and keeping it rented out. I could also take the money that would be going into the mortgage and put it directly into an index fund, for example.

With the money I would get by selling my house i could be a reasonable boat out right, and seed an emergency/maintenance account, and income could go into retirement funds.

But the big question is, as has been brought up, how much boat do I need? I don't know yet, but I'll find out soon!

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by thursday

Thank you for the response. I'm of two minds about it: certainly maintaining it makes it easier to go back to land if it turns out I don't enjoy the life but on the other hand, the money I would have by selling my place would allow me to buy a nicer boat and it would be one less liability.

I'm learning closer to selling it. I am lucky in that I have a safety net of friends I can fall back on if things don't work out and even if I lost all of my house money in a boat, within a few years I would be in a position to put a down payment on a home. So that makes me more inclined to just go all the way.

What do you think? Do you suggest holding onto my abode just in case I don't like the life? Or are you more thinking as a source of income via the rent?

Thank you!

I don't know the European housing market but the US market is hot 90% of the time. I suppose it depends on your age. If you are over 50, it might be difficult to buy back in and have the house paid off by the time you retire. The boat does not have to be "nice" or large or expensive. The experience of voyaging is the same. But wouldn't it be nice if after 3 years, you could find a nice and cheap place to lay up the boat for a year or so, go back to your home and chill a little bit. Maybe get back into the job market for a year or so, then go back to the boat and push on.

My ranch appreciates, currently, about $80K a year. My boat?...naaa.

To me, it makes more financial sense to do both. Even if it takes saving for an extra year. You need patience.

[AKA-None]

How big is your current living space?

[thursday]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

How big is your current living space?

I currently live in 40 square meters, but with 2 storage rooms in my building, so all considering it's a bit more.

[Adelie]

Welcome

[thursday]

Thank you!

I've been on vacation for the past month so I haven't made much concrete progress other than looking at boats for sail on the various websites. It's pretty daunting, finding a boat, but luckily I'm not in a rush.

[desodave]

Welcome aboard thursday. There will be a space adjustment given your current living space. Think about your own space a lot more than accommodating friends and family. We're coastal cruisers on the west coast of Canada with no thoughts about giving up our house. We originally thought how nice it would be to have friends and family aboard, but that now happens once a year for about 10 days max with our daughter and family of 3. We bought a new to us boat last year, and it was all about the living space for the 2 of us ... improved guest accommodation was way down the list of priorities.
Also think about where you can moor a new boat. Moorage is hard to find in this area ... especially as a liveaboard. You'll want a home base while you learn both the boat and about living on it. Winter will be a bit cool but, looking at temp ranges for Malmo, it seems doable. We're 5° further S and it hit -14°C over Xmas ... unusually cold for about a week. The liveaboards in our marina all managed ... clothing layers, a good heater and a dehumidifier.
Good luck with your plans

[TrentePieds]

Thursday:

Having read your posts carefully, I should like to add the following, specifically in response to your direct question of whether to sell or rent your present shoreside accommodation, which I gather is quite small, 40 square metres you say, and located on a small island in northern Europe. You have referred to your accommodation as a house, but at 40 square metres (about 400 square feet), surely it cannot be considered a “house” in the ordinary sense? You also say that you've sailed the Swedish Archipelago in a 26 foot boat.

Can we assume, therefore, that what you live in now is what we Canadians would call a cabin or a cottage, i.e. what Swedes would call en sommarstuga, possibly on one of those lovely islands in the Stockholm Archipelago? Can we assume furthermore that you live alone, rather than with a partner?

Can we also assume that what you own is NOT a 40 square metre condominium in an apartment building, i.e. what swedes call en bostadslägenhet?

You will be aware that there is also a “Swedish Archipelago” off the west coast around Gothenburg. Living there, and sailing there, are obviously quite different from living and sailing in the Stockholm Archipelago! And so is cruising down the west coast of Europe. Rounding Skagen will show you that :-)!

One can obviously only answer your question of whether to sell or to let your accommodation sensibly if one knows the answers to those I've asked above. But the fundamental rule – never exchange an appreciating asset for a wasting one – has already been laid before you. In most circumstances it therefore makes sense to let ones accommodation, rather than sell it, if one is going to be gone from it for some considerable time. There are firms that, against a fee, normally a percentage of the rent, will handle the day-to-day problems of landlording.

But IF your present accommodation is en sommarstuga, those problems are of a different texture than they would be if your accommodation is a conventional house, let alone en bostadslägenhet in central Stockholm.

Once you have a sensible answer to your sell/let problem, you can begin to think about acquiring a boat, and what kind of boat it should be. You've already had some pointers in that regard, so I'll only add at this point that you will find that BUYING the boat is the easy part. Most people can find the funds to do that. The hard part, particularly if you cut all ties with the land by selling your shoreside accommodation, is to find the funds to KEEP the boat! Expenses will in rough terms go up according to the square of the increase in waterline length, and perhaps a little more. So a boat that is 37 feet on the waterline will cost at least twice as much to keep as a boat that is 25 feet on the waterline because 37/25 = 1.5 (approx) and 1.5^2 = 2.25. In metric terms a boat advertised as a 12M boat will, ceteris paribus, cost twice as much, or more, to keep as a boat advertised as a 9M boat.

You might also like to know, since price levels are not significantly different from place to place in this world of ”globalization”, that I transfer from my income Can$1,000/month into the special ”boat account” to keep my 9M boat. Some of that is what is technically called a ”sinking fund” [very apt, eh :-)?] that ensures that I have the cash readily when sails and other expensive bits require replacement. Be aware that ALL bits and pieces other than the basic hull should be considered ”consumables”!

Lycka till :-)!

TrentePieds