Did I act correctly in a gale?

[jim King]

I was cruising from Vis to Korcula in the Adriatic when the winds calmed to the point that we decided to take the sails down and motor. Within five minutes a squall hit us from behind with 48 knot winds. we made it into a safe harbor in Korcula to find several other boats hunkering down. Several of them had ripped and destroyed sails from the same squall. I was glad we had taken everything down when we did.

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by thinwater

In retrospect, I have never experienced a squall or storm where there was no warning. In my youth, whether I listened attentively is another question . Anyone can underestimate conditions. But there is always some warning.

Point taken, and thanks for the polite correction.

I should have said unanticipated. Couple years ago a small rain storm brewed up less than 1km from an anchorage, everyone watched it on radar, and within minutes we had microbursts and winds clocked at 74mph. As opposed to a squall seen coming for two hours.

[Cliffhanger]

To answer your question, I think you did the right thing. Every boat is different though and handles in a different way. We get a lot of squalls around here and my response is: If I see it in time I get the sails down and motor slowly up wind. Once over, get the sails up again and off you go. Getting caught in a squall with full sails up is a different thing and has happened to me several times. Reefing in these conditions is difficult, if not dangerous. If there is enough sea room then head downwind around 120-160 degrees. Apparent wind is reduced and a following sea a lot more comfortable. If there is a lee shore then your only real option is ease the sheets until the sails luff (just before they start to flog) This works well for our catamaran. Some monohulls work better by just heaving too.

[Tupaia]

The only mistake the OP made was not being aware of where he was sailing and he was surprised.

Areas like the Tuscan Archipelago and Korcula are subject to Mistral and Bura winds. The blasts, gusts call them what you will, often result from the offshore winds being affected by the topography on the mainland, funneling between islands called accelleration zones and sometimes Katabatic where cold air suddenly falls from higher ground. They have no visible signs. When sailing in areas like this you should always be vigilant by being aware of changes on the water surface and the proximity of land masses. Understanding and being prepared to de-power quickly.

True squalls are the results of local low pressure zones and are usually preceded by cloud formations much easier to spot and prepare for.

Other areas such as Vanuatu, The Canary Islands and Spanish Rias. accelleration zones between but no squalls in the true sense.

[IslandInfedel]

I’d err on the side of going 0 sails and being a powerboat if something looks nasty or things look to be changing very quickly, major wind direction changes, pressure drop, cloud formations, localized rain, radar returns

“But I’m a great sailor and my boat is better under sail”

So was that tree

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dOSIjoZnHwI

[Paul Howard]

If motoring into the wind wind, all sails should be down and you should just fast idle into it, only keeping steerage to point into the waves. Motoring too fast is rough and hard on the crew. This is a typical commercial fisherman tactic.
Should the engine die, you can lie ahull if you have some, but limited searoom, just turn the wheel so the rudder is at about 20degrees off center.

If you have lots of searoom, steer downwind with bare poles, though 45knots is hardly worth it for this tactic, but it does decrease the apparent wind and there should be enough speed for steerage of up to 30degrees either side of dead down wind.
I would heave-to, leaving reduced sail area up and ready to return to the desired sailing course.
With any tactic, slowing the boat makes it easier on the crew.

[malbert73]

So thinking about squalls (not gales), and knowing it’s difficult to predict the ones that will pack 60-70 kt gusts/microbursts, what do folks do in catamarans? Ie is there a sail combo that’s safe in that much wind? In a mono if you get it wrong you’ll get knocked down and maybe shred a sail but that’s it aside from MOB risk in a knockdown

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by malbert73

So thinking about squalls (not gales), and knowing it’s difficult to predict the ones that will pack 60-70 kt gusts/microbursts, what do folks do in catamarans? Ie is there a sail combo that’s safe in that much wind? In a mono if you get it wrong you’ll get knocked down and maybe shred a sail but that’s it aside from MOB risk in a knockdown

A bit of thread drift here. This is one of the primary differences between mono's and multi's.

On a modern lightweight cat if you get hit close hauled or on a reach the best tactic is to dump the jib. I don't mean let it out I mean dump it. At the same time dump the traveler. This de-powers the rig and allows the main to weathercock, the boat will stop almost instantly. The reason for dumping the traveler and not the mainsheet is to stop the mainsail from powering up and turning the boat to windward. This is more important on a reach and is a consideration on boats with double mainsheets in lou of a traveler. At the same time leaving sheets on drum winches or cleats when in unsettled conditions is a no no.

With the wind aft then bearing away uses the boat's acceleration to reduce the apparent wind allowing time to reduce sail in a controlled manner. Rounding up or heading into the wind during a gust makes the boat vulnerable to capsize due to the centrifugal forces generated as the boat accelerates.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by malbert73

So thinking about squalls (not gales), and knowing it’s difficult to predict the ones that will pack 60-70 kt gusts/microbursts, what do folks do in catamarans? Ie is there a sail combo that’s safe in that much wind? In a mono if you get it wrong you’ll get knocked down and maybe shred a sail but that’s it aside from MOB risk in a knockdown

Cats are stiffer and so could shred the sail more easily BUT cat sails tend to be built tougher due to a number of factors. You may have noticed their masts are beefier too as a is their standing rigging.


Cats are much easier and safer to manage in a heavy blow as they provide a flatter and more stable platform to work on. However, cats tend to be shallower and have more windage (tall hulls, tall bridgedecks, etc.) - so any land in the lee is getting closer this much faster. No good.



Imho there is no good sail combination for 60+ knots of wind. Most boats will elect bare poles in such conditions. A trysail can be used up to a point as well as any deeply rolled heavy genoa or a storm-style trinquete. But generally beyond a point there are no sails.


There is a good feature from Skip Novak on heavy weather sails, search the web or ask Yachting Monthly for a backcopy.



I will try to attach a link to the imho very problematic windage structure of a modern cruising cat. An amazing feature otherwise.



So briefly, you want to allow for the kind of boat you are in. A cat sailor will build and deploy a somewhat different set of heavy weather tricks than a mono sailor.


windage ... ? :https://yacht-phuket.com/wp-content/...tamaran-14.jpg


windage ... ? :
https://img.nauticexpo.com/images_ne...35-8972985.jpg





Cheers,

barnakiel

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

So briefly, you want to allow for the kind of boat you are in. A cat sailor will build and deploy a somewhat different set of heavy weather tricks than a mono sailor.

Definitely. And a cat sailor is also likely to be more comfortable relying more heavily on engine power, as there are typically 2 of them with separate fuel tanks. So the chance of losing all power in one shot if something goes wrong is much lower.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by IslandInfedel

I’d err on the side of going 0 sails and being a powerboat if something looks nasty or things look to be changing very quickly, major wind direction changes, pressure drop, cloud formations, localized rain, radar returns

“But I’m a great sailor and my boat is better under sail”

So was that tree

Spectacular!


BIG thx for sharing!


I was not aware it gets this bad.



b.

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Cats are stiffer and so could shred the sail more easily BUT cat sails tend to be built tougher due to a number of factors. You may have noticed their masts are beefier too as a is their standing rigging.


Cats are much easier and safer to manage in a heavy blow as they provide a flatter and more stable platform to work on. However, cats tend to be shallower and have more windage (tall hulls, tall bridgedecks, etc.) - so any land in the lee is getting closer this much faster. No good.



Imho there is no good sail combination for 60+ knots of wind. Most boats will elect bare poles in such conditions. A trysail can be used up to a point as well as any deeply rolled heavy genoa or a storm-style trinquete. But generally beyond a point there are no sails.


There is a good feature from Skip Novak on heavy weather sails, search the web or ask Yachting Monthly for a backcopy.



I will try to attach a link to the imho very problematic windage structure of a modern cruising cat. An amazing feature otherwise.



So briefly, you want to allow for the kind of boat you are in. A cat sailor will build and deploy a somewhat different set of heavy weather tricks than a mono sailor.


windage ... ? :https://yacht-phuket.com/wp-content/...tamaran-14.jpg


Cheers,

barnakiel

Wow a boat only a mother could love....

[moseriw]

depends: if it was just a gust - you did the right thing.
If it is was a longer term gale I would set some sails to sail it out and maybe keep the engine on idle (Always better to have two sorts of motion)

[edexter]

We are just coastal sailors at best, in the Chesapeake. Under the conditions you describe, I would be more comfortable with leaving some sail up in a boat with which I was totally familiar, and knew how quickly she would react when I needed to manage in a gust; in a rental, I would do what you did.

Squalls can go from a light wind one way to 60 knots the other way very quickly. Maybe head downwind if there was room and it wasn't the wrong way, otherwise, churn on unless it became unmanageable. Our little boat has roller furling both main and genoa, so you can pull them in quickly if need be, and adjust them so they are balanced even with a lot of wind; but not a lot of ballast in the swinging centerboard.

But the bow is higher and the cockpit stays pretty dry even when green water is coming over the bow, so I might put the bow at an angle to the waves and keep going regardless of the wind direction. Whatever feels most comfortable is probably right.

[Vaya Con Dios]

It never fails to amaze me how many go to sea with a life boat, but not a para-anchor. Every commercial boat has one, but somehow it gets lost on many of the members of these forums (Maybe they haven't really been to sea). In gale force or for that matter simply stronger seas, when you would like to get some rest from a storm or simply wait out a storm in comfort, you heave-to a para-anchor, and I would never go out to sea without one. Do a little research on para-anchors and don't limit yourself to the advice given by people who must be spending all of their time on a yacht club bar stool. Storms are serious stuff, and I have just read advice that will surely get people killed.