Heaving to vs. fore reaching: defining characteristics

[JPK]

Curious to hear what everyone thinks are the defining characteristics of heaving to vs. fore reaching. Here's how I understand them:

Heaving to: Passive technique (helm can be left untended). Jib backwinded, main eased, helm locked to windward, boat pointing ~40-60 deg. into the wind, boat slowly makes leeway with a slick trailing to windward off the bow.

Fore reaching: Active technique (helm cannot be left untended). Sailing on main alone. Main sheeted tight. Making slow forward progress in an "S" pattern through the swells as the the boat pinches and then falls off. Slick trailing to leeward off the stern.

Here's the specific situation that prompts the question: recently I was in a course and we were practicing heaving to. We executed it per the "textbook" US Sailing procedure, i.e., backwinding the jib, easing the main and turning the wheel to windward and locking it down. The boat took a few moments to stabilize but eventually settled into a position with the bow about 45 deg. off the wind and sat there (as expected). All good, except our slick was trailing off behind us, indicating that we were still making headway rather than making leeway with our slick off our bow. So... were we hove to or were we fore reaching? As I understand it, one of the main benefits of heaving to in heavy weather (other than that it is a "passive" technique that allows you to go down below and regroup for a bit) is that the slick trailing off the bow to windward causes waves to break on the slick rather than breaking on the bow. So having our slick trailing behind us seems to negate one of the main benefits of heaving to as a heavy weather technique. Obviously if you're just heaving to to have lunch it doesn't really matter. I know that the specifics of heaving to (or the ability to heave to at all) vary from boat to boat (FWIW, this was a Jeanneau SO 389). What, if anything could we have done differently in this situation?

[BAD ORCA]

following. I wonder this as well. I dont know what im doing wrong but i cant seem to get into a 'hove to' position without making forward progress at about 1.5 to 2 kts.

I cant remember exactly but i want to say that the Pardeys used a parachute type anchor/drogue while hove to to get the boat into the proper position in heavy weather. I need to go back and watch their video again though i might be mistaken. .

[Don C L]

IME it’s kind of hard to get the newer boats to hold still once hove to. IMO you were hove to even though you were making headway. Actually my old boat doesn’t hold still either. Try it easing the main more next time, or put another reef in it.

[Orion Jim]

I’ve practiced being hove to in light winds but when I was in a full gale in the Gulf Stream I just reduced sail as the wind and seas continued to rise and I was able to fore-reach, with just a couple square yards (at the most) of my headsail, comfortably in a steady 47 knots with gusts well in excess. I estimated the seas at twenty feet. My Monitor windvane handled the helm easily and I spent the majority of my time belowdecks and set an alarm to scan the horizon and monitor the rigs integrity. AIS B is a wonderful thing in such circumstances. I also switched on my radar when visibility was severely restricted.
Orion has a cutaway full keel and a cutter rig. Each vessel will react differently under such circumstances. Luckily I had plenty of sea room so my course was not restricted in that sense.

[Briis]

Heave to manoeuvre never stops the boat fully. Don’t be fooled by those who actually haven’t used this in practice. Theory is one, practice another thing. There’s 1-3 knot drift (usually downwind) on most boats. But that’s still better than going 5+ with almost bare poles.

IMO every sailor doing longer passages should practice heave to regularly if the boat has decent keel and sailplan balance. Most boats should perform well enough to help you rest in rough conditions without changing your position too much to start again in a day or two once the worst passes.

[JPK]

Originally Posted by Briis

Heave to manoeuvre never stops the boat fully. Don’t be fooled by those who actually haven’t used this in practice. Theory is one, practice another thing.

Understood.

Originally Posted by Briis

There’s 1-3 knot drift (usually downwind) on most boats...

It's that "usually downwind" part that I'm inquiring about. If, when attempting to heave to, one does not end up drifting downwind, what changes to the sails would one attempt in order to go from making headway to making leeway? Reducing the size of the jib? or the main? or both? Why? I'd like to understand the principles behind what effect these changes would have on how a boat would heave to in heavy weather.

[Don C L]

In my own case I am balancing the windvane effect of the backwinded jib and the drive of the main and the windvaning of the main from the long foot on the mainsail. With your boat, now that I think of it, with a higher aspect and maybe a full-battened main, I'd also experiment with furling and flattening the jib hard against the shrouds a bit more so that it will windvane the bow off the wind and not get any drive when at that 45 degree angle.

[Don C L]

And keep the storm oil handy!
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ers-92014.html

[JPK]

Originally Posted by Don C L

And keep the storm oil handy!
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ers-92014.html

Fascinating! I'd never heard that before. I had to double-check to make sure this wasn't some sort of April fool's joke thread.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by JPK

Fascinating! I'd never heard that before. I had to double-check to make sure this wasn't some sort of April fool's joke thread.

Nope, it's supposed to work. Maybe just keep a big jug of vegetable oil upside down in the sink and let it drain out slowly? (I haven't tried it yet but it's supposed to reduce the breaking part of the oncoming waves which are usually the ones that splash over the boat.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Storm_oil

[JPA Cate]

Our old 36 footer, fin keel, high aspect ratio main, the first time we tried to heave her to in real wind strength (roughly 55 kn. in SF Bay during a Thanksgiving storm when we went out to practice), she just took off on the other tack, didn't give a hoot it was backwinded. To get it to really backwind, we used a snatch block on the perforated toe rail, well forward of the shrouds, finally, and if we worked with it then, we could keep her pretty still, but, it was not the seas one would find well offshore, either. Eventually we could get her pretty slow ~1 kn., and she was both fore reaching a bit, and blowing off. The slick was not in the right place.

Later on, we used fore-reaching more and more as a tactic. With a small headsail to keep her head well up, and as many reefs as it took (we had 3 to work with). I am sensitive to jerky motion, prone to motion sickness, and I found that with two sails up, the boat heeled more, and somehow that worked out to more comfortable for me, so that's what we've done with this boat when caught out there in more wind than predicted. For me, the problem with the Pardey's plan is that it is too much stuff out there. I want to be able to change course or leave an area at my whim, and not take a half hour retrieving gear in a lumpy seaway. Ymmv.

Ann

[boatman61]

It definitely depends on keel shape..
On some fins when put in the heave to profile the boat will spin on its keel and go on the opposite tack so setting her up to Fore reach at around 3kts is all one can do.
On boats like a Westerly Longbow it's easier due to the longer fin (length along hull rather than depth) and skeg hung rudder.. she would settle into the right angle and fall off/head up within comfortable parameters averaging 1.5kts
The best boat I've hove to was a Hurley 22 which has a form of full keel but a spade rudder.. after various combinations in winds upto 60kts I finally settled on fully reefed main alone (no jib) which had her sitting comfortably heading up and falling off while drifting backwards at 1.5kts with the S bound Biscay current..
Took a long time to reach Spain but got there in the end..

[thomm225]

As a single hander and knowing how easily it is after a few days to get worn down, I try to use Heaving Too as much as possible in case I ever really need to use it in heavy weather.

Once set you can go below and rest.

So far it works great during squalls but since they don't usually last too long the waves are usually not that bad but you can relax with a beer to calm your nerves if there is lots of lightning.

A Jeanneau SO 389 sounds like it might be a hard boat to slow down, but I surely don't have that problem with my Bristol 27 with it's short waterline and full keel.

It heaves too pretty well.

In the book "A Voyage for Madmen by Peter Nichols" about the 1968 Golden Globe race he mentioned that all boats that Hove Too during the Fastnet 79 race survived the storm.

From the article:

https://www.nytimes.com/1979/09/17/a...r-sailing.html

“When the crew is losing their power in ability or desire, when they're thinking more of surviving and not winning the race, then it's wise to heave to,” he suggests. “And if the boat is leaking, then you have to ease up or the leak may get faster.

“The difference between crashing through stormy seas at four or five knots and heaving to is dramatic. It's delightful. The wind moderates. The pounding stops, and it's quiet. It's a good chance to heat up some soup and regroup.”

[AiniA]

Our experience was with a Bristol 45.5 which has a long fin keel to house a centreboard (12' draft with board down so a long board to house. We hove to on occasion and were quite stable and comfortable but we were always fore reaching at a knot or so. The Pardey's storm tactic book recommends using a parachute at 30° or 45° to bow (I forget which) to keep the boat in one place. We had all the required gear onboard but never felt the need to deploy it.

[Kettlewell]

IMHO, most modern boats with short fin keels and spade rudders will have a tough time truly heaving to so that you can leave the helm unattended for long. You can get the boat in the correct position, and then along comes a breaking sea, knocks your bow off, and suddenly you're running off and then spinning around with the sails cracking in the wind. Until it gets to the point you want to deploy a drogue or a parachute sea anchor the best tactic is to keep sailing and steering. Yes, it is tiring, but that often proves to be the most comfortable and safe tactic. In offshore gales you can steer around a lot of bad breaking seas, reducing stresses on the boat and the crew. If the wind is favorable, you can run off at a safe angle under reduced or no canvas, though a bit of sail is usually needed to allow you to control the boat properly. If you get too tired to continue, use the drogue or sea anchor. I've hung on a parachute sea anchor (off the stern, so was it a drogue?) for more than 24 hours when we lost steering offshore in a gale, and it allowed us to get some rest, have a hot meal, etc. One of the greatest dangers in a storm is getting so tired that you start to make poor decisions.