How Do You Attach Your Working / Storm Jib ?

[unbusted67]

I know a lot of people use solent rigs but they are quite expensive and kind of cumbersome. Is there anyone using head sails with built in dynema halyards? Does anyone yank down their genoa from the furler and rig a working jib in the alternate slot? Obviously a cutter/dual head sail rig is an option but again that strikes me as cumbersome and can be a real pain in the arse when it comes to tacking through the slot.

I am interested in hearing about other's choices because a working jib will be one of the first additions to my sail locker. I have been caught too many times trying to beat to windward with a half rolled, and extremely inefficient, genny

[bewitched]

I went cutter with removable inner stay. Genoa on a roller, staysail is hanked on.

Inshore, I usually remove the inner stay to get over the genoa tacking issue. The inner stay can quickly be put back on and staysail rigged if need be.

Offshore, the innerstay and staysail are rigged and the genoa can be rolled out as needed. Tacking isn't an issue offshore.

There is a bit of a gap between when the rolled in genoa starts to look ratchit and the staysail steps in, but this has never been significant enough (for me) to consider a smaller working Jib and all the associated sail change hassle that this would incur.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by bewitched

I went cutter with removable inner stay. Genoa on a roller, staysail is hanked on.

Inshore, I usually remove the inner stay to get over the genoa tacking issue. The inner stay can quickly be put back on and staysail rigged if need be.

Offshore, the innerstay and staysail are rigged and the genoa can be rolled out as needed. Tacking isn't an issue offshore.

There is a bit of a gap between when the rolled in genoa starts to look ratchit and the staysail steps in, but this has never been significant enough (for me) to consider a smaller working Jib and all the associated sail change hassle that this would incur.

Exactly the same setup I went with. Seems to offer the best options and compromises for me.

[unbusted67]

What is the same setup?

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by unbusted67

What is the same setup?

Sorry I wasn't clear. Meant to indicate by quoting the post from Bewitched that I used the same setup he uses

Cutter rig with Genoa on a roller furler, hank on staysail, removable staysail stay.

Roller Genoa for ease and convenience.

Hank on staysail for reliability and simplicity for use as attachment for storm jib.

Removable staysail to eliminate tacking problems when that is an issue (but as Bewitched says, not a problem offshore).

[Benz]

You could set an inner stay'sl flying on a low-stretch inner halyard, as I do with my stay'sl. Though I have a forestay to hank it to, I choose not to, thus making unclipping the foot and stowing the sail out of the way very easy. My halyard is Vectran V-100.

[svHyLyte]

Originally Posted by Benz

You could set an inner stay'sl flying on a low-stretch inner halyard, as I do with my stay'sl. Though I have a forestay to hank it to, I choose not to, thus making unclipping the foot and stowing the sail out of the way very easy. My halyard is Vectran V-100.

We have an ATN style storm jib that sets over the furled Genoa. It works but it is a pain in the neck to set unless one does so quite early on. I have often pondered the alternative of having a spectra luff rope sewn in and setting the sail free-flying from a pad-eye inboard by 6' or so from the stemhead with our 2nd (T-900) jib halyard but have questioned my ability to get adaquate tension on the luff. Your observations will be appreciated...

[Jentine]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

.................. I have often pondered the alternative of having a spectra luff rope sewn in and setting the sail free-flying from a pad-eye inboard by 6' or so from the stemhead with our 2nd (T-900) jib halyard but have questioned my ability to get adaquate tension on the luff. Your observations will be appreciated...

That is the best idea I have heard in a long time.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

We have an ATN style storm jib that sets over the furled Genoa. It works but it is a pain in the neck to set unless one does so quite early on. I have often pondered the alternative of having a spectra luff rope sewn in and setting the sail free-flying from a pad-eye inboard by 6' or so from the stemhead with our 2nd (T-900) jib halyard but have questioned my ability to get adaquate tension on the luff. Your observations will be appreciated...

Sounds good when you say it fast, but I really don't think one can get the luff tight enough to emulate a proper stay's support when going to weather. Off the wind it might well work ok.There is also the issue of handling a free-flying sail under storm conditions. I think that even a ~100 sq ft storm jib would be a real handful in 40+ knots.

Too bad, because the system would be a godsend to many of us.

Currently we use a heavy stays'l on a solent roller, but find that with our fractional rig a very deeply reefed main by itself often works better upwind than adding a poorly shaped partial stays'l. I'm not thrilled with this setup, and am considering alternatives.


Cheers,

Jim

[Paul L]

I use an inner stay of dynex dux and softhanks for my storm jib. The stay is removable. Offshore (and most of the time) the sail is in a sausage bag on the foredeck with stay in place. Easy to setup, low weight in in the rig, fairly easy to remove. I use spectra lashings under the deck to a bulkhead for reinforcement. The stay is tightened with lashings from Coligo.

[bewitched]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

I have often pondered the alternative of having a spectra luff rope sewn in and setting the sail free-flying from a pad-eye inboard by 6' or so from the stemhead with our 2nd (T-900) jib halyard but have questioned my ability to get adaquate tension on the luff. Your observations will be appreciated...

I have the same reservations as Jim about not having a stay to run the sail up in a blow. However, as a bit of a side note, this is exactly the system used on a number of single handed open 60's (stormsail on a Fancor endless furler).

When I added the inner stay, I considered that a pad eye and the foredeck would not take the loads, so I took the loads via a chainplate to the hull.

[unbusted67]

Originally Posted by bewitched

I have the same reservations as Jim about not having a stay to run the sail up in a blow. However, as a bit of a side note, this is exactly the system used on a number of single handed open 60's (stormsail on a Fancor endless furler).

Yeah I was going to mention that. The open 60 guys use integral spectra or dynema halyards. If it's goo enough for them...

[svHyLyte]

Originally Posted by bewitched

I have the same reservations as Jim about not having a stay to run the sail up in a blow. However, as a bit of a side note, this is exactly the system used on a number of single handed open 60's (stormsail on a Fancor endless furler).

When I added the inner stay, I considered that a pad eye and the foredeck would not take the loads, so I took the loads via a chainplate to the hull.

The pad-eye I refer to is tied to a bulk-head below deck so that is not an issue. I was/am somewhat more concerned with being able to set the luff-stay up tightly enough to allow the sail to be effective to weather. The Gale-Sail works well but on our boat it is sizable and can be a handful to manage, even running off. I'd also prefer getting the sail's CE a bit closer to the mast.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by unbusted67

Yeah I was going to mention that. The open 60 guys use integral spectra or dynema halyards. If it's goo enough for them...

Probably depends a lot on the crew. The Open 60 guys are essentially professionals and in top shape. A Mom & Pop cruising boat might not have the same horsepower and stamina to set a free flying sail in 45 knots of air after being beat up for awhile. I'd prefer to have a setup with a dyneema stay in place.

[svHyLyte]

Originally Posted by Paul L

I use an inner stay of dynex dux and softhanks for my storm jib. The stay is removable. Offshore (and most of the time) the sail is in a sausage bag on the foredeck with stay in place. Easy to setup, low weight in in the rig, fairly easy to remove. I use spectra lashings under the deck to a bulkhead for reinforcement. The stay is tightened with lashings from Coligo.

Paul--

This is very interesting information. How do you set the stay up (Highfield Lever?) and can you give us a bit more info on the "Soft Hanks" with which I am not acquainted.