MOB - broad reaching or DDW, what is the best approach?

[meirriba]

Usually, we train and exercise MOB recovery starting with the boat close hauled. There is a lot of heated discussion on various forums examining various drills.
But nobody promises that this is the only circumstance that a crew member may fall out into the water.
What would you suggest as a good approach when the boat is on a broad reach or running downwind? possibly also with a spinnaker, be it asymmetric or symmetric sail.
And maybe worse situation in my opinion - running DDW with wing on wing headsails supported on two whisker poles?

[StuM]

Here's one approach that I teach.

[Dockhead]

There are as many approaches as there are boats, crews, and conditions. You really just have to play around with it until you find the way that works for you.


Big factors in choice of tactics are (a) how hard is it to get your sails down; and (b) what kind of mechanical propulsion do you have?


In our case, we have all sails on roller furlers, and 100 horsepressure of Yanmar. So that is a vivid case for the "quick stop" method, of which I am a big fan, however, it is not right for every boat or every crew.


Sailing upwind-ish, I do nothing but haul in the mainsheet (if necessary), and put the helm over to put the boat into a hove-to position. Very very fast. Start the engine, get the sails down, and motor to the victim. In reasonable conditions this can be done within a few boatlengths of the victim, which is key -- much less risk of losing sight of him, much faster getting back to him.


Downwind or -ish, is more complicated. But normally, in reasonable conditions, I would do more or less the same thing, or something like Stu's maneuver above, except that I would not tack over the jib in order to wind up hove-to. Then get the sails down and motor over.


In big conditions and downwind it becomes much more complicated. Lying to a drogue I think it is almost hopeless. Running off in a storm it may be impossible to turn around and claw back upwind. If someone has some ideas for such conditions, I'm all ears.


But even in biggish, but not storm conditions, running downwind, is complicated. I might choose to sail (and use exactly Stu's maneuver above) instead of motor, if I could lay the victim under sail. Because sails give more power even than a 100hp Yanmar, and you might need that power to bash your way back to the victim.


I think it's important to practice frequently, and creatively, so that you and your crew have a variety of tactics in your quiver.

[Suijin]

In safety at sea seminars they teach what they call the “quick stop” for DDW with kite up. The mechanics of course vary depending on crew and boat but the focus is the same; get the kite down and the boat turned around as quickly as possible. Obviously if you’re short handed that is a challenge but you have to figure out how to do it with your circumstances. If you can douse the kite with the letterbox method that is probably the easiest with respect to keeping control as it comes down and not create a whole other problem.

The key is speed, with control. Staying as close as possible to the MOB is the overriding priority. If you lose sight of them in a seaway recovery becomes exponentially more difficult.

In sum you need to design a solution that works for your boat, your crew, and your sailplan.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Suijin

. . .

The key is speed, with control. Staying as close as possible to the MOB is the overriding priority. If you lose sight of them in a seaway recovery becomes exponentially more difficult.

. . .

Words to live by.



The word "exponentially" here is not an exaggeration.

[Bean Counter]

With only two aboard a 45ft cat with 2000 sqft spinnaker up, down wind in say 15 + knots my thoughts would be to throw over Dan buoy, press MOB button for 3 seconds, if the crew can not get the kite down, would be to steer at say 160 AWA, autopilot on, let the sheets go or cut, and cut or free the halyard and lose the spinnaker which in theory would not drop right in front of the boat. The alternative of motoring back up wind with spinnaker draped all over the boat with possibility of fouling props with sheets or torn kite would be unwise I think. We wear AIS transponders so hopefully that would be working (we test them). Then motor around and drop the mainsail when head to wind. I have only theory on this and have not practiced letting the spinnaker go (may be practice with a float attached so it can be recovered?). Of course it is best to be clipped on so no need to lose a kite or a crewman


I since have found this article:
https://www.yachtingworld.com/news/b...pinnaker-68196

[thinwater]

Remember that for most cruisers, this will be single handed and it will probably be your wife that is driving.


Given the confusion that will follow, perhaps pressing the MOB button is the most important step. By the time she gets the chute down or twin sails down (if she even can) you will be miles out of sight.


My school, unless the crew are quite good sailors, is to have them drop the sails and use the motor. Just keeping track of the swimmer on-your-own is really tough. I've recovered enough hats to be sure.


In this case...

1. Bear off and drop the chute. Don't do it in a panic or it will end up in the water, which will slow you even more. Do it right.
2. Straight back. Get all lines in.
3. Start the motor.
4. Drop the main. Slow down if need be.

At least with a cat and twin engines, you are in MUCH better control this way.

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by Bean Counter

I since have found this article:
https://www.yachtingworld.com/news/b...pinnaker-68196

Good reason to check you don’t have stop knots on the ends of your kite halyard and lines.

On reading this article and thinking about it for about 8 seconds I agree that it’s the best course of action. Worrying about loosing an expensive sail in a MOB situation is like wondering if the airline will give you a refund when your plane is in an uncontrolled dive.

This tactic gets you headed back upwind as soon as possible. I suppose if your asym has a smoothly functioning sock that bringing it down might be almost as quick, but seconds count.

[boatman61]

One reason I like single line furlers for asymmetrics..

[AdamLoory]

Here is a link to a video showing how to do a MOB recovery when sailing with the spinnaker up. It is on the UK Sailmakers website and you'll need to enter your e-mail address to see it. SAS - Quick Stop with Spinnaker — UK Sailmakers

[sailing_gal]

I sail short-handed alot (actually, often solo). But I would like to add a few things to the discussion. First, if you have a MOB, throw EVERYTHING that floats out of the cockpit- spare PFDs, cushions, rubber balls- ANYTHING. THEN mark your position and turn the boat around, however you are going to do it. For 2 reasons--- one, your MOB needs something to help him float, even if he is wearing a PFD, the more floating stuff the merrier. Also, the stuff you throw out will drift with the current, similarly, but not exactly, to how the person is drifting and will be much easier for you to see. A mop of dark hair in water is almost impossible to see if you should lose sight of the person for an instant. I did a lot of MOB training with the Coast Guard as a volunteer, and always, first order of business was- throw something into the water.

[AdamLoory]

I totally agree on throwing everything that floats over the side as soon as possible. The "debris field" will mark the person's position well and hopefully give the MOB something to help keep their head out of the water. Shorthanded sailors must practice with the Lifesling. Once the person in the water gets into the Lifesling's collar, they are attached to the boat, which gives the sole person aboard a chance to get the sails down and to rig up a halyard so that the person can be winched aboard.

[Bean Counter]

We carry this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMGWk6s9G4k

and a life sling.

[meirriba]

Seems that the technique presented by StuM is the solution for downwind sailing under genoa & main only.
With a spinaker - losing the sail overboard.
I still wonder about a procedure when running under twin poles or with an asymetric like ours that has nontorque line in the luff that would be very tough to cut. Furling it may be the fastest thing to do which may take for an experienced crew about 30 seconds - long way from the MOB before you start the going upwind manuever. Maybe we need a quick release of the entire furling drum that can be released from the deck. The sheets and halyard can be released from the cockpit.

[roverhi]

I did an impromptu MOB sailing DDW with poled out headsail. Threw a life jacket overboard and proceeded to get the boat turned around and back to pick up the Life Jacket. Never saw that Life Jacket again. The time to take down the pole and drop the sail, get the engine started and boat turned around carried us so far away finding the Life Jacket was hopeless. Almost immediately lost position of the Life Jacket so had no idea where to look for it in the featureless offshore ocean. This was pre GPS and didn't have a MOB pole with flag.

Lessons learned: Get something overboard immediately that can be easily seen, either a pole with flag or the Dan Buoy type, immediately. With any sea running you lose sight of the MOB almost immediately without raised marker. Hit the MOB function on your GPS next or simultaneously if you have crew. Kind of up in the air which is more important. Offshore you have little hope of finding someone if you don't know where to search either by a raised flag type of buoy or position on the GPS once you lose sight of the MOB.