US couple buying catamaran in Turkey and traveling around with our dog

[iabmatos]

Hi Claudine,

For longer temporary visas - BEWARE OF BECOMING AN EU-TAX RESIDENT AFTER 183 DAYS and the implications regarding VAT.


Enjoy

[sepharad]

You have some US hoops to jump through before moving on to Europe. These involve careful timing of what tests, vaccines and certificates you get. There order and timing in relationship to your departure date is critical. Most annoying is the State Veterinarians office.



Each state USED to have an USDA state veterinarian. Your tax dollars are apparently too paltry to provide this service any longer. Multiple states may SHARE a single office requiring you transport your pet to another state for their cert. This is after getting your personal vet to examine and vaccinate.


This State vet is by appointment only Then you must return to your vet again for final tests just prior to departure. All of this...everything...must be documented. Certificate 10 days or less, prior to departure. Good for 4 months ONLY.



https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/our...animal-exports



Getting there involves finding a cooperative and honest airlines. Want to fly KLM? Oh ya uff course! Ve love pets!


Then you realize the KLM flight you are scheduling isn't on a KLM plane and the sub-carrier they have sold you a ticket for, wont carry pets. The ticketing airline may be flying you on someone elses fleet.



Do your due diligence. Lufthansa flew my dog through Frankfurt and then on to Portugal with either Lufthansa or TAP.


Some breeds are not always welcome on planes. Mastiffs, pit bulls, Akitas, Malinois and dogs with mashed in faces like pugs and boxers may not be welcome on-board. Do your due diligence.



Make sure the "airline approved crate", is actually airline approved! Just because they tell you it's a unicorn, you may be getting a donkey with a horn glued to its head.


As soon as you get to Europe, go to a local vet. They will again test and vaccinate your pet and issue the "Passaporte de Animal De Compania".


Some countries like Italy and Ireland will not issue you a pet passport unless you are a resident. Others like Spain and Portugal will. (yeah yeah, due diligence)



Take your chip brand and number. They will scan and enter this info in the passport. it must be “ISO 11784/11785 compliant 15 digit microchip”. 30+ days prior to trip.



Rabies vaccine more than 21 days before transport.


The rabies antibody titration test is mandatory for pet animals entering the EU. An authorized veterinarian must carry out the test at least 30 days after the date of vaccination against rabies.
Moreover, you must wait 3 months from the date the successful blood sample was taken before you can travel.



Once you have finally arrived there ( oh yeah, and been inspected at the Airport maybe yes, maybe no) and obtained a pet passport, things get easier...sometimes. I hear Greece is much better now. 40 years ago when i took my first dog to Europe, you would think I had a wolf on a chain. Pets were unknown. Now they are much more common and even popular. Turkey may still be another issue. Muslim countries have no history of dogs as pets (hunting exception) and have taboos about purity.



Take a muzzle for public transport if they will even let you onboard. Portugal yes, Spain no.


Learn what countries are rabies free zones. Having a nice vaccinated, EU pet passport pet can go out the window if you enter a RABIES zone country


Part 1 listed countries

Part 1 listed countries and territories operate under the same EU Pet Travel Scheme rules as EU member states. There are a very few countries in this group.
These countries are: Andorra, Switzerland, Faroe Islands, Gibraltar, Greenland, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Vatican City State.


Part 2 listed countries

The majority of countries are Part 2 listed, which means they need to meet additional conditions, such as the use of temporary health certificates.
These countries are: Ascension Island, United Arab Emirates, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Australia, Aruba, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Barbados, Bahrain, Bermuda, Bonaire, Saint Eustatius and Saba (the BES Islands), Belarus, Canada, Chile, Curaçao, Fiji, Falkland Islands, Hong Kong, Jamaica, Japan, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Cayman Islands, Saint Lucia, Montserrat, North Macedonia, Mauritius, Mexico, Malaysia, New Caledonia, New Zealand, French Polynesia, Saint Pierre and Miquelon, Russia, Singapore, Saint Helena, Saint Maarten, Trinidad and Tobago, Taiwan, United States of America, American Samoa, Guam, Northern Mariana Islands, Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, British Virgin Islands, Vanuatu, Wallis and Futuna, Mayotte.


https://food.ec.europa.eu/animals/mo...u-countries_en


If you enter a rabies country, they may refuse you to re-enter the EU, or toss your dog into quarantine.


http://gamapserver.who.int/mapLibrar...ITHRiskMap.png


Please note Turkey may be in the risk category and cause you issues.

Unlisted countries

If a country has not applied or has not been accepted as a Part 1 or Part 2 listed country, it means it is categorized as an unlisted third country. In such cases, pet owners must take some specific actions several months before they travel to Europe.

[Montanan]

Are you sure that your dog and your new cat will get along together? Incompatible pets may be a real challenge while cruising.

Just asking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ew81OiKMEy4&t=35s

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Claudine

We plan to go to France first for a week or two before Turkey. We then plan to stay in turkey around 90 days.

We then plan to go to Greece and travel around the med for a year going towards Spain and eventually sail back to the US after about a year.

Claudine, the time spent in France initiates the 90 days in any rolling 180 day period of time as your ability to stay in the Schengen territory.

Definitely see if you can obtain a long-stay visa, get started immediately on that.

It is possible to obtain a long-term visa in a specific Schengen country, which will thence work as a valid visa for the entire Schengen zone.

Do not overstay the 90 days in any 180 day rolling period in the Schengen without a long-term visa, else you will endanger being deported and also your ability to return anew to the Schengen, in which case you will become separated from your cat.

Reference: https://traveltips.usatoday.com/long...sa-109082.html

https://france-visas.gouv.fr/en_US/w...long-stay-visa

[Claudine]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Are you sure that your dog and your new cat will get along together? Incompatible pets may be a real challenge while cruising.

Just asking.

Thanks for the laugh! I needed it after reading all of the posts in this thread. My brain is melted. OMG the hoops to get to anywhere and stay there legally and return are ridiculous.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Claudine

Thanks for the laugh! I needed it after reading all of the posts in this thread. My brain is melted. OMG the hoops to get to anywhere and stay there legally and return are ridiculous.

OMG, so now you want to also return with your pets, well that is another can of worms entirely.

FYI. Turkey is listed as one of the US Center for Disease Control countries of high risk for rabies.

Notice of Temporary Suspension of Dogs Entering the United States from Countries Classified as High Risk for Dog Rabies

https://www.cdc.gov/importation/brin...g-ban-frn.html

Summary of Most Recent Changes

Starting June 10, 2022, the temporary suspension for dogs entering the United States from high-risk countries for dog rabies will be extended until January 2023. This includes dogs arriving from countries without high risk of rabies if the dogs have been in a high-risk country in the past 6 months. The extension will expand eligibility for importation from high-risk countries to all people, provided the dogs meet the requirements below.

UPDATE June 10, 2022:

Dogs vaccinated against rabies in the United States by a US-licensed veterinarian may re-enter the United States from a high-risk country without a CDC Dog Import Permit if the dog:

has a current, valid US-issued rabies vaccination certificate;
has proof of an ISO-compatible microchip;
is at least 6 months old;
is healthy upon arrival; and
arrives at one of the 18 airports with a CDC quarantine station
Be sure to make arrangements to enter the USA via one of the 18 airports with a CDC quarantine station.

Expired US-issued rabies vaccination certificates will not be accepted. If the US-issued rabies vaccination certificate has expired, the dog must get a booster dose outside the United States and meet requirements for foreign-vaccinated dogs (see below).
For foreign-vaccinated dogs coming from high-risk countries, there are additional options for bringing in 1-2 dogs or 3 or more dogs.

Three or more dogs coming from high-risk countries can now arrive at specific ports of entry with a prior reservation at a CDC-approved animal care facility. All dogs must have a valid rabies vaccination certificate and adequate rabies serologic titer or complete a 28-day quarantine at the US animal care facility. This option is also available to shipments of 1-2 dogs arriving without a CDC Dog Import Permit.

This temporary action is necessary to ensure the health and safety of dogs imported into the United States and to protect the public’s health against the reintroduction of canine rabies virus variant (dog rabies) into the United States.

In 2020, CDC identified a significant increase compared with the previous 2 years in the number of imported dogs that were denied entry into the United States from high-risk countries. Due to reduced flight schedules, dogs denied entry are facing longer wait times to be returned to their country of departure, leading to illness and even death in some cases.

CDC estimates 6% of all dogs imported into the Unites States arrive from countries at high risk for dog rabies. Inadequately vaccinated dogs are not protected against rabies and are a public health threat. Rabies is fatal in both humans and animals, and the importation of even one rabid dog could result in transmission to humans, pets, and wildlife. Dog rabies has been eliminated from the United States since 2007. This suspension will protect the health and safety of imported dogs by preventing importations of dogs inadequately vaccinated against rabies and will protect the public’s health against the reintroduction of dog rabies.

CDC has coordinated with other federal agencies and entities as necessary to implement this action, and CDC will review this suspension periodically.

Dogs from high-risk countries may be imported only with CDC’s advance written approval (CDC Dog Import Permit), including dogs imported from a country NOT at high risk if the dogs have been in a high-risk country during the previous 6 months. Such approvals may be granted on a limited case-by-case basis at CDC’s discretion. If your request for advance approval to import a dog is denied, CDC’s written denial will constitute final agency action. No appeals will be allowed.

To request advance written approval, you must follow the instructions at How to Apply for a CDC Dog Import Permit at least 30 business days (6 weeks) before you intend to enter the United States. Requests cannot be made at the port of entry upon arrival into the United States.

Dogs that arrive from high-risk countries without a valid US-issued rabies vaccination certificate, a CDC Dog Import Permit, or a reservation at a CDC-approved animal care facility will be denied entry and returned to the country of departure at the importer’s expense.

Before entering or re-entering the United States with a dog, importers should continue to check other federal regulations as well as rabies vaccination requirements of state and local governments at their final destination.

List of countries of high risk for rabies.

Reference:

https://www.cdc.gov/importation/brin...high-risk.html

You best determine what the customs protocols will be for entering the EU when your dog has been in Turkey because likely the EU has also sanctioned Turkey as a high risk country for rabies and may have unique [not ridiculous] requirements for importing a dog [and perhaps your cat] from Turkey. Hmmmn, not sure about importing Turkeys from Turkey.

Now if your spouse gets rabies, well that involves yet further hoops to jump through.

Teaching your cat to jump through hoops is a lot like herding cats, no joy.

Guidance for teaching your dog to jump through hoops:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQRLWZfAa74

[Montanan]

FYI:

Transiting the European Union,


If your pet is traveling through (transiting) a country in the European Union (EU) on the way to a third, non-EU country, you will also need a transit health certificate for your pet for the EU. The transit health certificate will be the same as if your pet’s final destination was the EU country. Use the information and steps below to determine which health certificate should be used.
https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/pet...ttravel-france

If the pet has a valid EU Pet Passport, it may not need an export health certificate.
If the pet’s current rabies vaccination was given in the United States, the pet cannot use the EU Pet Passport and must obtain an export health certificate.
A USDA Accredited Veterinarian may enter tapeworm treatment information into a pet dog’s EU Pet Passport but should not enter rabies vaccination information into any EU Pet Passport.


NOTE: Effective May 1, 2020, due to COVID-19 health concerns, the Turkish Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry (MINAF) has order pets entering Turkey to complete an in-home quarantine for 14 days.

I recommend contacting the Turkish Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry to determine what the latest Covid-19 order is for pet quarantines. The word "Quarantine" literally means 40 days, so 14 days is a shortening of the time period of isolation.


Turkey allows USDA Accredited Veterinarians to use USDA’s online Veterinary Export Health Certification System (VEHCS) to complete health certificates.

https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/pet...ttravel-turkey

Requirements for returning your pet to the USA; note not all animals are consider pets.

https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/pet...-united-states

Turkey is a country that is not free of Hoof and Mouth Disease so you will need to provide compliance for US CDC compliance for HMD exposure.
Foot and Mouth Disease
Dogs coming from a country that is not declared free of foot and mouth disease must meet the following requirements:

Their fur and bedding must be free of excessive dirt, hay, or straw.
The dog should be bathed as soon as it reaches its destination and kept separate from all livestock for 5 days after entering the United States.
Dogs used in livestock handling that are imported from any part of the world except Canada, Mexico, and certain regions of Central America and the West Indies should have no evidence of tapeworm infection.

Note that your State may have additional requirement for reentry of your dog. US Customs is just the first level or importation requirements.
Link through to individual State requirements: https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/pet...l-dogs-into-us

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Claudine, the time spent in France initiates the 90 days in any rolling 180 day period of time as your ability to stay in the Schengen territory.

Definitely see if you can obtain a long-stay visa, get started immediately on that.

It is possible to obtain a long-term visa in a specific Schengen country, which will thence work as a valid visa for the entire Schengen zone.

Do not overstay the 90 days in any 180 day rolling period in the Schengen without a long-term visa, else you will endanger being deported and also your ability to return anew to the Schengen, in which case you will become separated from your cat.

Reference: https://traveltips.usatoday.com/long...sa-109082.html

https://france-visas.gouv.fr/en_US/w...long-stay-visa

No national visa transfers to other countries as they are all specific to the particular country.

Let’s say you get a French long stay ( 6 months) that does NOT extend to any other EU country , where you will still get 90 out of 180. ( in addition to the visa stay time )

In practice long stay visa a ( 6 months ) are difficult to get unless you are actually moving to that country ( retiring there or studying etc ) there are all sorts of requirements for health insurance , finance requirements etc etc etc. don’t be misled by people saying “ get a long term visa ) it’s not easy ( it’s way more difficult for us Europeans to extend our visiting time in the US)

In my view bringing the dog /cat isn’t a great idea. It’s a load of hassle.

[Claudine]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

No national visa transfers to other countries as they are all specific to the particular country.

Let’s say you get a French long stay ( 6 months) that does NOT extend to any other EU country , where you will still get 90 out of 180. ( in addition to the visa stay time )

In practice long stay visa a ( 6 months ) are difficult to get unless you are actually moving to that country ( retiring there or studying etc ) there are all sorts of requirements for health insurance , finance requirements etc etc etc. don’t be misled by people saying “ get a long term visa ) it’s not easy ( it’s way more difficult for us Europeans to extend our visiting time in the US)

In my view bringing the dog /cat isn’t a great idea. It’s a load of hassle.

Leaving our dog behind is not an option, so we have to figure something out. This is so stressful.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

No national visa transfers to other countries as they are all specific to the particular country.

Let’s say you get a French long stay ( 6 months) that does NOT extend to any other EU country , where you will still get 90 out of 180. ( in addition to the visa stay time )



Indeed the long stay visa only applies to staying in the country of issuance, it does not provide for a means to extend the Schengen travel visa beyond the 90 days in rolling 180 day period for visitation to other Schengen countries.

By way of example, for any stay in France exceeding 90 days, you are required to apply in advance for a long-stay vis. In this instance your nationality does not exempt you from requirements.

Whatever the duration of your planned stay, the duration of your long-stay visa must be between three months and one year. In order to extend your stay beyond the period of validity of your visa, you must apply for a residence permit at a prefecture.

During its period of validity, the long-stay visa is equivalent to a Schengen visa, enabling you to move around and stay in the Schengen Area outside France for periods not exceeding 90 days over any period of 180 consecutive days, under the same conditions as if you held a Schengen visa.


In practice long stay visa a ( 6 months ) are difficult to get unless you are actually moving to that country ( retiring there or studying etc ) there are all sorts of requirements for health insurance , finance requirements etc etc etc. don’t be misled by people saying “ get a long term visa ) it’s not easy ( it’s way more difficult for us Europeans to extend our visiting time in the US)
Yep, and it takes months, or even over a year to just obtain an appointment with a US Embassy or Consulate to have an interview to discuss issuance of a long stay visa to the USA.

In my view bringing the dog /cat isn’t a great idea. It’s a load of hassle.

Reference link to how to train your dog to go potty on board: https://theboatgalley.com/training-dog-boat-dog/

Reference comments above.

[Montanan]

Recommend that you make plans for a Schengen visa protocol.

No more than a cumulative 90 days in any rolling 180 day period.

Time spent outside of the Schengen is not included in the tolling period. Example, 90 days in Turkey then 90 days in the Schengen. Repeat.

Or 90 days in the Schengen and 90 days back in the USA.

Be sure to clear out properly with the country immigration authorities so as to be documented each and everytime that you depart the Schengen else the computer will register that you did not depart and have overstayed and then you will have big difficulties.

And thus need to deal repeatedly with all the entry and reentry and transit paperwork associated therewith for you and the Dog.

As to the dog being aboard a cat, well that is your choice but adds considerable regulatory difficulty and daily hassles.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Claudine

Leaving our dog behind is not an option, so we have to figure something out. This is so stressful.

You need to plan your route carefully and evaluate your timescales then ensure your allowed timescales match up with the pet importation process. Your problem is moving into and out of the EU. Many of these certificates have validity periods etc.

You can arrange some things in the USA , but some will have to be done in the EU.

The big delay items are the rabies titration tests as these must allows 3 months to elapse and hence you need to ensure you can stay in that country ( or want too )

For example

US to france
ISO microchip and documentation
rabies vaccine
Eu approved animal health certificate ( can be acquired in the US)

France to Turkey
Turkish approved animal health certificate ( this could be sourced in the US or France but there are validity time limits )

Turkey to Greece
EU health certificate
Rabies vaccine
Rabies test ( 3 month delay )
( note the importation of animals that have been in Turkey is currently banned in the US)

Inter EU
EU pet passport sourced in an EU country.

If you are flying , assuming you have an airline that accepts pets in the hold, all this documentation will be examined at airport both at departure and on arrival

Note that for the EU and many other countries you must arrive at a designated port of entry that can clear in pets. You cannot just appear at any old port. This can be a major problem as the ports that process animals are usually commercial and not marinas

The whole pet transport thing assumes you are travelling by a commercial entity not a private yacht.

[Montanan]

Per the Turkish Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry:
https://www.tarimorman.gov.tr/Konula...hracat-Ithalat

Approved Laboratories in the USA Where Blood Tests Can Be Performed for Cats and
Dogs Traveling to the European Union

US – AMERİKA BİRLEŞİK
DEVLETLERİ
- Kansas State University Rabies laboratory
1800 Denison Avenue, Mosier Hall
Manhattan, Kansas, USA 66503
Tel/Fax : +1.785.532.4483 / 4474
E-mail : rabies@vet.ksu.edu


- VETCOM Food analysis and diagnostic laboratory
2472 Schofield Road, building 2632
Fort Sam Houston
Texas 78234- 6232
Tel : 00.1.210.295.4604
E-mail : Edwin_Cooper@ln.amedd.army.m

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Claudine

Thanks for the info. She was microchipped over a year ago. We will be going to France first to visit family and plan to get an EU pet passport before going to Turkey. We would like to stay in Turkey around 90 days and then begin to travel to Greece and go west from there. We’d like to stay in the med for about a year before returning to the states. When we go back into Europe, we can just re-enter with the same EU pet passport? Will we need anything returning to the EU after 90 days in Turkey? Thank you very much!

Again to travel to Turkey you will need a Turkish approved animal health certificate. This could be done in France or USA , ( you might as well get it in France alongside the passport )

You will have to stay in Turkey longer as the rabies test will have to be administered there and that’s a 3 month delay. ( longer if the animal fails ) You will need a EU animal health declaration filled in in Turkey as the pet passport is not valid from outside to inside EU travel.

Once within the EU you can use the pet passport with no further ado.

Personally if I had a way I’d have the animals minded in the EU and not brought to Turkey.

Note that to stay a “ year “ in the med you will require to spend essentially 6 months outside the EU Schengen area. This has significant implications for your pet importation and exportation depending on which countries you spend that time in and what ports of entry can process the animals. ( again the EU pet passport is an internal EU scheme only)

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Per the Turkish Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry:
https://www.tarimorman.gov.tr/Konula...hracat-Ithalat

Approved Laboratories in the USA Where Blood Tests Can Be Performed for Cats and
Dogs Traveling to the European Union

US – AMERİKA BİRLEŞİK
DEVLETLERİ
- Kansas State University Rabies laboratory
1800 Denison Avenue, Mosier Hall
Manhattan, Kansas, USA 66503
Tel/Fax : +1.785.532.4483 / 4474
E-mail : rabies@vet.ksu.edu


- VETCOM Food analysis and diagnostic laboratory
2472 Schofield Road, building 2632
Fort Sam Houston
Texas 78234- 6232
Tel : 00.1.210.295.4604
E-mail : Edwin_Cooper@ln.amedd.army.m

Since a EU pet passport is needed and will have to be obtained in an EU country ( ie France ) you might as well have the French vet fill out the Turkish animal health document. ( it will be cheaper then the US too )

Again bear in mind these regulations assume you are arriving by commercial carrier , you must entry at a port that has the designated ability to process pet importation eg Turkey.

“pet should arrive at customs by 11:30AM for same day customs clearance. It can take 5-6 hours to clear a pet once landed in Turkey. Pets arriving 3:00 PM will be subject to extra fees.”

Also bear in mind that the declaration of animal health can involve blood tests and can take time but has limited validity , you need to be careful that the sea journey doesn’t invalidate the validity time. ( it usually is fine )

Failure to follow the rules usually results in mandatory quarantine at your expends for a considerable period.